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Volvo D24(T): What exactly is the problem with them?
by
lord_verminaard
on 19 Jun, 2008 15:20
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I see these engines getting bashed all over the internet, about how they are junk, not reliable, etc... when I know good and well that it's a 6-cylinder VW engine.
What really is the problem with them? I've heard of oiling issues, cylinder head cracking, cooling issues, etc... Which are true and not true? Are there any solutions to these problems?
I'm asking because I am very close to closing the deal on a Volvo for another project car. I could go the normal route and build a nice fast B23FT and have a very fun car, or I could go the other way and build up a D24T. Obviously I would rather have a Diesel but if it will be more trouble than it's worth then I'll go the other way with it. Thanks!
Brendan
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#1
by
the caveman
on 19 Jun, 2008 15:43
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I don't own one but i have been servicing one for the last 1 1/2 years. It's a 86 760 volvo which was converted to run on WVO 3 years ago. HE has never had a breakdown until recently. 2 years ago he had all or most of the valves changed, and all new gaskets [he was told]. The thing has been covered in oil since i started working on it so i don't think they did everything. 6 injectors replaced last fall. about 5 weeks ago he called me up because it wouldn't start. He figured it was the used starter he had just put on the week before. Brought it into the shop, saw the timing belt had jumped. Remove the front covers and realized that the crank pulley was loose. Crank still okay, camshaft broken IN 5 PEICES !! Haven't pulled the head but all the valve heads are all at exactly the same height so i'm hopeing they are all okay. Couldn't replace the front crank seal so i figured i would just remove the flange to push it out from behind. WRONG!
Manual says to remove motor because the front flange is also the oil pump. Lifted the motor enough to drop the pan and remove flange. Am now reinstalling everything. All to say that it seems to be robust because this customer does very minimal maintainence and when running is smooth with fair amount of power [still slow, it's an automatic]. Pain to time the pump as it's the rear ,driven by it's own belt and the bolts for the IP are not super easy to get to. I have heard that they don't like short trips, the oil needs to get real hot to lube everything properly, i have convinced him to use synthetic as a result.
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#2
by
Northern RD
on 19 Jun, 2008 16:36
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I see these engines getting bashed all over the internet, about how they are junk, not reliable, etc... when I know good and well that it's a 6-cylinder VW engine.
What really is the problem with them? I've heard of oiling issues, cylinder head cracking, cooling issues, etc... Which are true and not true? Are there any solutions to these problems?
I'm asking because I am very close to closing the deal on a Volvo for another project car. I could go the normal route and build a nice fast B23FT and have a very fun car, or I could go the other way and build up a D24T. Obviously I would rather have a Diesel but if it will be more trouble than it's worth then I'll go the other way with it. Thanks!
Brendan
http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/677341/740/760/780/740_turbo_diesel_one_loooong.html :wink:
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#3
by
the caveman
on 21 Jun, 2008 12:02
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Have now determined that the cam broke because the 4 cam bearing caps
were all gouged and showed signs of poor oil ciculation and or not enough oil changes . Lightly sanded all the bearing surfaces enough to remove the ridges, checked clearences and installed a good used cam. Should see today how she runs. Poor customer, the car's been here for 5 weeks, just didn't have time until now.
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#4
by
the caveman
on 21 Jun, 2008 12:02
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Have now determined that the cam broke because the 4 cam bearing caps
were all gouged and showed signs of poor oil ciculation and or not enough oil changes . Lightly sanded all the bearing surfaces enough to remove the ridges, checked clearences and installed a good used cam. Should see today how she runs. Poor customer, the car's been here for 5 weeks, just didn't have time until now.
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#5
by
lord_verminaard
on 23 Jun, 2008 10:22
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Poor oil circulation. Hmm. Is that a design flaw or improper maintenance? I read of people using thinner weight synthetic oil to help. I've also even seen a few mentions of drilling/tapping additional oil return/feed ports in various places but have not seen any details/pictures of such an operation.
Of course, this would all be moot if I don't get the car or if I can't find a d24t for cheap.
Brendan
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#6
by
Eli
on 30 Jun, 2008 23:04
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This is a quote from Tom Bryant, arguably the most knowledgeable person in the US when it comes to D24/t's
As for the disparaging remarks about the engine itself, well, they're mostly just plain, demonstrably, wrong. These engines definitely do not have "lubrication issues" for example. They are intolerant of dino oil, especially if not changed frequently, and they are intolerant of overheating, as well as neglect or misuse. But when properly cared for, they will last indefinitely. Problem is, most people just don't know how to properly care for them. Couple that with some sloppy design specs and tolerances and many having been improperly assembled, right from the factory, and you have a recipe for trouble.
Here is the thread it came from.
http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=102101It's rather in depth seeing as it's a 14 page thread. It starts off with people trash talking the engine, and then a lot of stuff really gets hashed out. Theres really a lot of information in there though, if your interested.
I myself really like this engine, and am glad more and more people are starting to realize it's worthwhile, maybe even great.
-Eli
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#7
by
bevboyy
on 22 Jul, 2008 19:11
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Cylinder #6 never quite got enough oil and caused HG issues. That is what I have seen on at least 3 of them in my past.
For the amount of HP that engine produced, it would be better to bolt in a 1.6 or 1.9 TD as they are much more plentiful and bolt up to the trans.
Better weight distribution, more power.
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#8
by
lord_verminaard
on 28 Jul, 2008 10:27
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I'm pretty sure the bellhousing is Volvo-specific, sharing the same mounting pattern as the Volvo gassers.
Brendan
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#9
by
jbg
on 01 Aug, 2008 18:29
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I'm pretty sure the bellhousing is Volvo-specific, sharing the same mounting pattern as the Volvo gassers.
Brendan
The bellhousing pattern is Audi, same as the 5-cylinder gas and diesel engines.
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#10
by
ranger station
on 17 Aug, 2008 00:00
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I HAVE A 24D ON WHICH I INSTALED A TURBO AND INTERCOOLER.
I HAVE DRIVEN IT FOR 2 SUMMERS AND IT WORKS VERY WELL SO FAR.
IT HAS THE SAME PISTONS, RINGS, RODS, BEARINGS, INJECTORS, GLOW PLUGS AS A 1.6 VW.
MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THE CYLINDERS ARE SOFTER MATERIAL AND WEAR OUT AFTER ABOUT 300000 KM.
IT WILL TAKE ME A WHILE TO PUT THAT MANY KM ON THIS TRUCK SO I AM NOT TO WORRIED ABOUT IT.
CHECK IT OUT AT
www.freewebs.com/rangenstation CLICK ON PHOTO GALLERY
HAPPY DIESELING
DAVE
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#11
by
gigaz2
on 17 Aug, 2008 06:21
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I'm pretty sure the bellhousing is Volvo-specific, sharing the same mounting pattern as the Volvo gassers.
Brendan
The bellhousing pattern is Audi, same as the 5-cylinder gas and diesel engines.
actually Audi started making they're bellhousings with two mounting patterns, for 4 cyl and 5cyl engines, I guess Volvo did the same, or did it use a different bellhousing for each type of engine?
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#12
by
madmedix
on 02 Sep, 2008 19:41
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As the past owner (RIP 2 years ago) of an '88 740 Turbo Wagon; She was smooooth and lovely....and very thirsty....and no matter what route you take, be wary of the O/D on the manual. If it does go funky, check the wires under the shifter-mounted switch first - tends to ground out and keep the solenoid from engaging the OD. And if you have to service the OE Nivomat rear shock system...switch it out. The cost savings will keep your beer fridge full for a very long time.
Andy