Author Topic: 100% biodiesel  (Read 28481 times)

Reply #30December 14, 2007, 08:07:05 pm

madmedix

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100% biodiesel
« Reply #30 on: December 14, 2007, 08:07:05 pm »
Benjamin, what are you running the stock lines in? Mk 2, 3, 4....?
'90 TD Jetta

Reply #31December 14, 2007, 08:28:26 pm

bigblockchev

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« Reply #31 on: December 14, 2007, 08:28:26 pm »
In colder climates the winter diesel fuel or D1 is in effect kerosene, here where it is not as cold the winter fuel is 50% kerosene 50% reg diesel. If I were running up north I would be using Stanadyne or some such in every tankful as kerosene has very little lubricity, though ULSD is  poor at lubrication as well. Generally anti-gell agents are not very effective in BD , some folks have found that you have to use 3 or 4 times as much to get any significant benefit. Cheers Dan
it's always something simple
one test is worth a thousand guesses
95 Chev Suburban 6.5 w performance mods
91 Mercedes 300D 603.960 6cyl 3L
87 Mercedes 190D 2.5 Turbo
2000 Jetta TDI
76 Onan  MDJF 15Kw genset
5.5 years and counting on B100

Reply #32December 14, 2007, 08:35:53 pm

Slave2School

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100% biodiesel
« Reply #32 on: December 14, 2007, 08:35:53 pm »
Are there any good mainstream bio-antigel additive me3ant specifically for that purpose?  I'd like to run bio in the 324td when it is on the road but it'll be "snapping arsehole cold" in Trenton (moving next summer) for 6 months of the year.
Waiting for a bigger better diesel to come along.
2002 ford focme wagon

Reply #33December 14, 2007, 08:53:29 pm

bigblockchev

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« Reply #33 on: December 14, 2007, 08:53:29 pm »
If I were faced with continuous cold temps I probably would just run 50% BD and 50% reg diesel and call it good for as long as the temps stayed down. I am not aware of any specific products which are proven effective with BD. Another aspect of the issue is that BD itself can be made from many different feedstocks. Canola, Soy, Palm, etc and even some percentage of animal fat. all these have different temperature characteristics.  When it comes down to it having a reliable vehicle is critical especially in winter, frozen fuel lines will not impress the wifey. I always leave room in my tank in winter in case I have to add some reg diesel. Cheers Dan
it's always something simple
one test is worth a thousand guesses
95 Chev Suburban 6.5 w performance mods
91 Mercedes 300D 603.960 6cyl 3L
87 Mercedes 190D 2.5 Turbo
2000 Jetta TDI
76 Onan  MDJF 15Kw genset
5.5 years and counting on B100

Reply #34December 14, 2007, 09:02:20 pm

Slave2School

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« Reply #34 on: December 14, 2007, 09:02:20 pm »
So true Dan :)  Never anger the wife.
Waiting for a bigger better diesel to come along.
2002 ford focme wagon

Reply #35December 15, 2007, 09:48:51 pm

BejamminR

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100% biodiesel
« Reply #35 on: December 15, 2007, 09:48:51 pm »
Glad to help out, Vanagoner.

Quote from: "bigblockchev"
In colder climates the winter diesel fuel or D1 is in effect kerosene


Nope. It's possible that you have some information that I don't, but as far as I am aware, here's the score: A lighter diesel fuel is used, and larger proportions of kerosene are blended; some areas do use the name D1 / Diesel #1 to refer to kerosene / jet fuel variants, but as far as I know, on-road diesel fuel is never more than a 50% blend of kerosene. That's important, because straight kerosene can (Not that it will, but can) wreck things in very short order. Its lubricity is dramatically lower than diesel fuel, and it is flatly not recommended for use in normal applications. Special low-lubricity components do exist for use in military applications and stuff where jet fuel / kerosene is what will be used, but even with those components, the pump wears out way faster due to super low lubricity.

Gotta agree with you on the B50. Unless you have some form of tank heating, or a secondary tank with heating, or something along those lines, I would not recommend anything over B50 in continuously sub-zero temps. I've personally experienced gelling at low temps with B50 blends, and basically had to go easy until the return fuel heated the tank, pump, etc. If it had been a little colder, I'd have been euchred.

Slave2school:
(Just realized that Bigblockchev has already said a bunch of this - I'll leave it here, but take it as agreement and elabouration. :-) )
No ratio of kerosene / Biodiesel has been "proven" safe, because so far as I'm aware that testing hasn't been done. I don't personally know how well kero blends with B100, what it does to the lubricity of the biodiesel, etc. Since kerosene is more expensive, pretty bad for your pump, and more hydrophilic than diesel fuel (at least as hydrophilic as B100), I don't see any real advantages to using it, other than letting you run B100. I'd be more inclined to drop down to B30 with the rest petrodiesel rather than B50 or B60 with the rest kerosene, based on price, longevity, and (anecdotal) evidence to support its reliability. That's me; I won't tell you that it won't work or that it can't, I just don't have the data to be comfortable making the decision or making a recommendation at this point. From a practical standpoint, I think that in the absence of a heating system, scaling back on the biodiesel proportion is the cheapest, easiest, and lowest-maintenance option for a couple of months of the year at most.

Bearing in mind that I live in the GTA part of the time and in very rural central Ontario the rest of the time, so -20C and below is not foreign territory - our climate is classified as "sub-arctic". In even slightly lower latitudes, none of this applies.

There presently aren't any real winterizing additives made specifically for biodiesel. Again, the market is sufficiently small that nobody really cares. The most effective "winterizing" method I've heard of is freezing cans / jugs of biodiesel to a given temperature (in your freezer, for instance) in order to solidify it. Usually, a portion of it remains liquid; you pour this off, recording the freeze / cloud / cold filter plugging point on the container. This is largely unscientific, but it gives you an idea of the temp. The solidified stuff can be thawed and re-used as "summer B100" and the thinner portion can then be stored and used as "winter B100" down to the temps that you observed when freezing. It's a reasonably good system, and considerably better than blending, given the choice.

Reply #36December 15, 2007, 09:50:57 pm

BejamminR

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100% biodiesel
« Reply #36 on: December 15, 2007, 09:50:57 pm »
Quote from: "madmedix"
Benjamin, what are you running the stock lines in? Mk 2, 3, 4....?


Not sure what this question is asking. My Jetta is a Mk3 (1994 AAZ). I may have missed something prior to this, but I'm not sure what you're asking about the stock lines...

Reply #37January 03, 2008, 06:11:32 am

madmedix

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« Reply #37 on: January 03, 2008, 06:11:32 am »
Sorry, it was in reference to this:

 "As I may have already mentioned in this thread, I've logged in excess of 10,000km on biodiesel, and none of my lines (all stock) have been degraded in any way."

But as I understand it, a mk3?

Andy
'90 TD Jetta

Reply #38January 05, 2008, 08:51:58 pm

BejamminR

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« Reply #38 on: January 05, 2008, 08:51:58 pm »
Oh, gotcha. Yep, it's a Mk3 Jetta.

Reply #39February 14, 2011, 11:44:38 am

erice1984

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Re: 100% biodiesel
« Reply #39 on: February 14, 2011, 11:44:38 am »
A lot of great information here!   Anyone ever tried making their own biodiesel, and wish to elaborate?
1980 Rabbit 1.9TD


Reply #40February 14, 2011, 11:54:34 am

BejamminR

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Re: 100% biodiesel
« Reply #40 on: February 14, 2011, 11:54:34 am »
Indeed I have.  As far as elabourating... Basically everything I could say has already been said better by the guys at Journey To Forever.  (Link: www.journeytoforever.org)

Check through their biofuels sections - they are where I originally got the bulk of my information, and this remains one of the more thorough treatments of the subject as far as I know.  If you have specific questions, let me know and I may be able to answer them.  I haven't made very much biodiesel - I mostly run straight vegetable oil (waste oil, boiled, dewatered, filtered to 1 micron) and use commercially purchased biodiesel because it takes me less time and prep than processing into biodiesel myself.  Also, my suppliers for methanol stopped selling to anyone without commercial clearance for alcohols, so the reagents are harder and harder for me to get.  They're still out there, but harder for me to get now.

Reply #41February 14, 2011, 01:28:00 pm

bigblockchev

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Re: 100% biodiesel
« Reply #41 on: February 14, 2011, 01:28:00 pm »
Ben , sorry to disagree but Journey to forever is perhaps the worst source of information  on the internet for a newbie regarding biodiesel . The forums at biodiesel infopop are of a similar  informative quality to the Vw gtd forums here. Helpful without a lot of wrong information.  By the way it may be possible to purchase methanol in the form of windshield washer concentrate easier than the pure form. I have been using this for the past 3-4 years successfully , it is about 96% methyl hydrate by my measurement. Cheers Dan
it's always something simple
one test is worth a thousand guesses
95 Chev Suburban 6.5 w performance mods
91 Mercedes 300D 603.960 6cyl 3L
87 Mercedes 190D 2.5 Turbo
2000 Jetta TDI
76 Onan  MDJF 15Kw genset
5.5 years and counting on B100

Reply #42February 14, 2011, 02:34:21 pm

erice1984

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Re: 100% biodiesel
« Reply #42 on: February 14, 2011, 02:34:21 pm »
Thanks guys.  journeytoforever.org   is there too much information/too complex, or is it just a slew with some accurate and some inaccurate?
1980 Rabbit 1.9TD


Reply #43February 14, 2011, 02:59:10 pm

bigblockchev

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Re: 100% biodiesel
« Reply #43 on: February 14, 2011, 02:59:10 pm »
I have found it to be inaccurate, for instance they maintain that the processing formula should start at a base of 3.5 gms per litre of oil plus the additional amount obtained by titrating the oil. Most if not all other sources start with 5 gms per litre plus titration. I have used the greater amount in my processing formula for the last 5.5 yrs with excellent results and no failed batches I cannot imagine what my results would have been using with a lesser amount, probably a percentage of unconverted oil. Other sections of the website seem similarly uninformed. Cheers 
it's always something simple
one test is worth a thousand guesses
95 Chev Suburban 6.5 w performance mods
91 Mercedes 300D 603.960 6cyl 3L
87 Mercedes 190D 2.5 Turbo
2000 Jetta TDI
76 Onan  MDJF 15Kw genset
5.5 years and counting on B100

Reply #44February 14, 2011, 03:22:59 pm

RustyCaddy

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Re: 100% biodiesel
« Reply #44 on: February 14, 2011, 03:22:59 pm »
This is a really good BD site:

http://www.make-biodiesel.org/Introduction/