AAZ Pump - Do I Connect Constant 12v to the Extra Timing Solenoid?

[libbydiesel]

I have seen this question posted a gazillion times on various forums.  I have seen people answer both YES and NO.  I will staunchly say that if you want your engine to run well and have decent power, the answer is YES.  Power to that solenoid enables the dynamic timing.  In order to remove any doubt, I have personally installed my diesel pulse adapter and timing light and visually shown that without power to that solenoid, the injection timing actually gets progressively retarded.  With power connected, it advances as it should with RPM.  I have seen it stated that powering that extra solenoid will disable the load dependent timing advance.  Again, my personal testing using the timing light has not shown this to be the case.  Powering that solenoid or leaving power disconnected does not appear to have any affect on load dependent timing advance.  

To reiterate, without power is no advance.  With power dynamic advance works.  Put constant power to the solenoid.  

[rallydiesel]

Can you eliminate the need for electricity by replacing the solenoid with a spacer and plate of some sort?

[libbydiesel]

For the EMP weapons the Chinese use when they invade??

[rallydiesel]

LOL

[libbydiesel]

The AAZ end cap fitting has a second shimmed spring and is somewhat complicated in it's casting/machining.  You cannot simply replace it with a block-off plate.  Running a jumper wire from the stop solenoid is quick and easy, tho. 

[8v-of-fury]

For the EMP weapons the Chinese use when they invade??

I think that solenoid would likely be EMP immune, as well as the alternator. So you may need to bump start it, but should be able to remain with a 12v system for the pumps solenoids.

[burn_your_money]

Swap in a stop solenoid, it is the opposite of the advance solenoid. 12v open vs 12v closed.

Personally I think there is something wrong with this test (pump or equipment). I'm pretty sure that solenoid only controls the load dependent timing. I wish I had tested it when I worked with Giles.

If it actually did retard the timing, or even disable it, your car would run like a total bag, which it doesn't when it is hooked up vs not hooked up.

[libbydiesel]

I suppose the governor shaft depth could be set wrong, but there's nothing complicated about the test I did.  I attached the diesel pulse adapter pickup to the #1 injector line, hooked up the adapter and timing light and shined it on the flywheel with the engine running.  With 12v connected it advanced.  Without 12v connected it retarded.  Just for clarity, timing of the ACTUAL start of injection will retard progressively with rpms (it does not remain static with progressive rpms on a diesel) unless there is some advance type of mechanism just due to the physics of compressing the fuel and shooting it out the injector.

In the future I may check the behavior of the timing advance on one of my other VW diesels with an IN bolt in place for the OUT bolt and see if it behaves in a similar manner as when the 12v is not connected.

I haven't delved into the way the fuel pressure travels through that solenoid, but I have heard two descriptions of it's function.  One description went along the lines that deactivating that solenoid was done on engine overrun in order to retard the timing and reduce NOx emissions.  The other description I have heard is that power to that solenoid disables the load dependent timing advance, although with that description I have never heard of a reason and can't think of any why disabling the load dependent timing would be advantageous even to emissions. 

[mtrans]

libby-are we write about this,as I see there is two model some say one is advance other is retard and i need advance


My IP has nothing on,by factory of corse, can you tell me what is this

Its Reno IP by way.

[libbydiesel]

That is not the solenoid version I'm talking about.  That one, the pipe goes up to the internal pressure regulator.  The AAZ one it goes up to a banjo fitting that is right between the fuel inlet and the pressure regulator.  The one you are showing is like what is fitted to many Cummins 4BTA pumps.

The second of your pictures is of the idle/fast idle lever.

[mtrans]

Thx libby,
I am Fiat guy with VE pump very low on Cummins 4BTA pumps,is this meen that this is for retard?
When you say "The AAZ one it goes up to a banjo fitting that is right between the fuel inlet and the pressure regulator." does this mean that there is 3 banjo fitting,or is it my English?
I know yoa data man,I get that for 5 e,can you give me picture to find right one please.

[mtrans]

libby,any chance of picture that part?

[burn_your_money]

Ignore the arrow

[mtrans]

Thx Tyler,%$##,That is almost same as I have,so as I see that is 3 kind.

[danster]

Late AAZ pumps have an extra electric connection. Similar to the full E-TDI pumps.
I think this may be what libby is referring too. I know this is not an AAZ pump but I just used this image to show the one I mean.
Note the blue connector and wire going to the grey solenoid located under the black pump head.