Author Topic: WVO Anyone? (Read 3974 times)

BlackTieTD · « **on:** January 03, 2008, 09:33:28 am »

Curious as to what types of fuels we are using. I made it a poll so that you can remain anonymous if you are concerned that the authorities in your town will come knocking. :lol:

I'm a tool and I run petroleum-based diesel

upchuck · « **Reply #1 on:** January 28, 2008, 09:19:10 pm »

in seattle we have a bio-d seller that sources their oil from indonesian palm oil and i've seen them sell even cheaper than petroleum based diesel at times by about $.10-.15/gal. --nothing green about cutting down tropical rain forests to make biodiesel for wanna-be greenie birkenstock wearing starbucks junkies! -- of course the place that sells midwest soy based bio is always more than petroleum diesel by about $.20-.30+/gal

burn_your_money · « **Reply #2 on:** January 28, 2008, 09:23:35 pm »

I voted "No, I'm a tool and I run petroleum-based diesel" although technically I don't drive (anymore). I'll be running WVO when I can though. I prefer the heel-toe express but may have to upgrade to the meat and potatoes powered bicycle

Dr. Diesel · « **Reply #3 on:** January 29, 2008, 08:10:02 pm »

you forgot to add a jet fuel box.

burn_your_money · « **Reply #4 on:** February 08, 2008, 10:14:27 am »

I emailed the Ontario Ministry of Revenue about taxes for WVO and this was the response I received:

Thank you for your recent enquiry made through the Ministry of Revenue internet feedback site regarding the application of fuel tax to waste vegetable oil used in a vehicle.

Under the Fuel Tax Act, fuel is defined to mean any gas or liquid that may be used for the purpose of generating power by internal combustion, and includes any special product or any substance added to the gas or liquid. There are certain exceptions to this general definition. As you can see, the definition of “fuel” is very broad, and it is likely that the product you have described would fall within the definition of fuel at the time that you use it. However, as will be explained below, it is the character of the fuel at the time you acquire it that is determinative of whether fuel tax applies.

Fuel tax is applied on every litre of fuel received or used by a purchaser in Ontario. A purchaser is a person who acquires or receives fuel. The price paid for the fuel does not affect whether or not tax is applicable.

As you may be aware, biodiesel is exempt from tax under the Fuel Tax Act. “Biodiesel” means the ester-based oxygenated fuel, (a) that is derived from soybean oil, other vegetable oil or animal fat, and (b) that is used as a fuel or as a fuel additive with petroleum-based diesel fuel. You have not indicated whether the waste vegetable oil will undergo a transesterification process. Based on your description of the product you are using, we cannot determine whether it falls within the definition of biodiesel.

Without further explanation from you, we cannot be certain what the characteristics of the product in question are, but generally, we understand waste vegetable oil to be a product used in deep frying, which can be processed to be made into a product that can be used in a diesel vehicle which has been modified to use this fuel.

If the product you are acquiring cannot be used as fuel without processing by you, like filtering, dewatering, etc., then it would not fall within the definition of “fuel”, and would not be subject to fuel tax, and you may not be considered to be a “purchaser” under the Fuel Tax Act.

We trust this answers your questions.

Motor Fuels, Tobacco and Land Taxes Section
Tax Advisory Services Branch
Ontario Ministry of Revenue

http://www.rev.gov.on.ca

I like the way that sounds

addautomotive · « **Reply #5 on:** February 08, 2008, 10:36:51 am »

Good work, tyler!

Do you mind if I post that elsewhere?

In NB, I have to self-asses quarterly at the same tax rate as diesel.

burn_your_money · « **Reply #6 on:** February 08, 2008, 11:03:19 am »

by all means, spread the word

bvolks73 · « **Reply #7 on:** February 08, 2008, 11:34:03 am »

Quote from: "addautomotive"

Good work, tyler!

Do you mind if I post that elsewhere?

In NB, I have to self-asses quarterly at the same tax rate as diesel.

I was wondering how it worked around here. I just found a source of WVO and plan on trying to process some bio-diesel myself this spring.

addautomotive · « **Reply #8 on:** February 08, 2008, 11:47:47 am »

Actually Tyler, looks like they'll have you on the filtering & dewatering part:

Quote

If the product you are acquiring cannot be used as fuel without processing by you, like filtering, dewatering, etc., then it would not fall within the definition of “fuel”, and would not be subject to fuel tax, and you may not be considered to be a “purchaser” under the Fuel Tax Act.

Strange, because that means if you buy new veggie oil in 5 gal pails, it's exempt, but not if you get it FREE and filter it.

I would get clarification

TomB · « **Reply #9 on:** February 09, 2008, 04:05:32 pm »

There's a company in York that collects the WVO from the takeaways and turns it into fuel. There's a only a 20 pence concession in tax terms here though, so it's 85p/litre (but it still beats 105p/l for the regular stuff.
It can eat O-rings in fuel filters though....
Cheers,
Tom

jtanguay · « **Reply #10 on:** February 09, 2008, 08:57:07 pm »

Quote from: "addautomotive"

Actually Tyler, looks like they'll have you on the filtering & dewatering part:

Quote

If the product you are acquiring cannot be used as fuel without processing by you, like filtering, dewatering, etc., then it would not fall within the definition of “fuel”, and would not be subject to fuel tax, and you may not be considered to be a “purchaser” under the Fuel Tax Act.

Strange, because that means if you buy new veggie oil in 5 gal pails, it's exempt, but not if you get it FREE and filter it.

I would get clarification

wouldn't it be free if you had to filter it too???

fastguy69 · « **Reply #11 on:** April 10, 2008, 02:19:49 am »

If the product you are acquiring cannot be used as fuel without processing by you, like filtering, dewatering, etc., then it would not fall within the definition of “fuel”, and would not be subject to fuel tax, and you may not be considered to be a “purchaser” under the Fuel Tax Act.

Read that carefully.....It considers any kind of filtering processing. That means before the oil is filtered, it cannot be considered fuel, which means it cannot be taxed as a fuel. Now if you sell it after you filter it, then it is a fuel that needs to be taxed. Does that help?

burnt_servo · « **Reply #12 on:** April 10, 2008, 08:17:57 am »

Quote from: "fastguy69"

If the product you are acquiring cannot be used as fuel without processing by you, like filtering, dewatering, etc., then it would not fall within the definition of “fuel”, and would not be subject to fuel tax, and you may not be considered to be a “purchaser” under the Fuel Tax Act.

Read that carefully.....It considers any kind of filtering processing. That means before the oil is filtered, it cannot be considered fuel, which means it cannot be taxed as a fuel. Now if you sell it after you filter it, then it is a fuel that needs to be taxed. Does that help?

BUT if you sell it , and it still needs to be processed by the buyer , it still isn't considered "fuel" .

so maybe you filter it , but it still needs to be dewatered ........

fastguy69 · « **Reply #13 on:** April 10, 2008, 04:36:13 pm »

exactly.....as long as it still needs to be processed in some way, shape, or form, then it shouldn't be taxed.

Dirtrag2 · « **Reply #14 on:** April 11, 2008, 07:09:07 am »

Here in Quebec, the province is soon to introduce a new law with provisions to WVO and SVO :? basicly anything you put in a road vehicle for use on public roads must be taxed. ( 400$ fine first offence :shock: then 2000$ after )

the loophole is that they cannot inspect the vehicle, they are only allowed to insert a tube in to fuel tank to get a sample sa as long as you have a second "hidden" tank you're fine.

Next they plan to force restaurants into acquiring certificates of proper disposal for WVO seeing as the waste oil is considered a "hazedous material" under agricultural laws.

IT'S ALL A BIG CONSPIRACY MAN