VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.
General Information => General => Topic started by: Dr. Diesel on May 18, 2004, 05:03:45 pm
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Like the title says, Giles did some voodoo on his n/a rabbit delivery car's injection pump. Holy cow-pucky batman!! It's no turbo, but it scoots!! I'm sure with a dual downpipe/good exhaust, ported head and a lightened flywheel, it'd be a great little ride! For anyone wanting to up their N/A diesel without the hassel of turbocharging, send him your pump. IT'S WORTH IT!!!
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Rev higher? Maybe quicker advance curve? Should be normal "hot rod" stuff... :)
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Tell me :)
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Yeah, I want to hear about the back-shaved pintle mod too. Full disclosure!!!
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Just like the turbo engine's pump, the n/a diesel's rev limiter starts tapering off fuel delivery around 2800 rpm. The engine tops out at 5500 simply because it isn't getting enough fuel to pull to 5550. So, at 5400 at full throttle, it's more like you've let off the accelerator by 80%.
Now, change that rev limiter, modify the advance mechanism and some other nifty things, and you've got one hot little N/A bunny!
I don't think it was running out of air at all. I couldn't see any smoke at all in the mirror, and it was skip-to-my-loo-my-darling faster than any N/A diesel I've had before, and I've monkied with more than one of them, trust me.
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Actually, your answer makes sense to me, Doc. If you haven't actually added any fuel, then there is no reason it should smoke now if it wasn't before. "All" you have done is allow it to provide full fueling and advance to higher revs...cool! 8)
I'll bet it is a zippy little bunny! :D
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Yeah, I want to hear about the back-shaved pintle mod too. Full disclosure!!!
Me as well!
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I might be interested in the future. You have a quote on what this might cost Dr. Diesel?
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Call Giles
905-940-2266
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aprox. how much does giles cost to do up a pump for a td 1.6.?
i normally do my own pumps but it would be nice to see how one done up by "the man" performs 8)
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BTW where is he located too, thanks
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I also want to know about the timing advance piston mod.
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Call Giles at the number above, or pm him. He's on this board. Look on the member list. I don't imagine he'd be giving away blueprints on how to build up such a pump, but you can ask about pricing for sure.
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i dont want blueprint or anything like that. just wanted to see and feel the magic he works on the pumps, compare to some of the ones i have done up. i dont have a clean or prcise enough machine shop to preform most of the things he would do! i just adjust internal and external screws/springs. thanks
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Ok, so you remember me saying that I drove a Giles-tweaked N/A rabbit, and that I said it really scooted, and probably thought "yah, whatever"
WELL.......
We Gtech'd it. The little bunny picked up 22 HP AT THE WHEELS!!!
This test day was 2 degrees hotter than the day when it was tested before the mods.
So picture a n/a diesel, ported/polished, nice intake, header and exhaust, close ratio lightened flywheel. That'd put it up near stock GTI specs, probably with more torque!
COOL!
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So basicly, from 52hp to 74whp ???
I want to know how :)
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it was a gain of 22 net hp (which is affected by drag and incline) compared with before the mods. So, if you were to translate that back to crank hp, let's estimate 20%. Make it a gain of 27 crank hp up from 52 is 77 at the flywheel. Not bad for an old rattlebox.
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wow thats pretty good. any word on how far he goes on a tank with that pump? ..delivery vehicle after all..
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I don't know if he keeps track of it. I would suspect that for regular driving, it'd have gained mpg, due to the increase in engine efficiency. However, now that it's so much more fun to drive, I bet he leans on the loud pedal much more, so that gain's not always realized. You know how it is.
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I had a buddy pick me up a fuel pump at the local pick a part today and I am reading this thread with interest..as I'll be changing the timing belt soon...does anyone know someone who can perform the same magic on a pump near Va. ?? If I am not mistaken Giles is in Canada correct?..not sure how hard it would be to get a pump there and back...I have a PM to him right now re. $$ for his tricks..but am searching for local (relativly speaking) options also..
any help would be great...seeing as 22hp is pretty big when you are starting out with 52 hp..almost 50%..:):):)
I do a fair mix of hiway/city driving..so the extra pony-power would be good for squirting in and out of traffic..:)
thanks again
Keith "aka" Hutch
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Giles is on holiday till later in the month. I don't imaging it'd cost much to ship him a pump. When i've been in his shop, he's sending and receiving pumps, injectors etc via ups and fedex all day.
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Hey guys
had a wonderful time Cancun + Cozumel
I know all of u have lots of questions and i'd be glad to answer most
of them, short of telling everybody how to do their own pumps.
remember allot of the important stuff is done on the Calibratoin test
bench.
as for our Hot Rod Rabbit...
we got 53 HP at the wheels and before my pump mods 33
i drive the snot out of most the time and get 500 Km / 38-40 ltrs all city
www.performancediesel.ca
check out the Working Facilities page.
pls don't try to contact anyone else in the company as i am the only
who does these special mod's.
Here is a price list for anyone who wants it.
1.6L pump N/A normal overhaul $650
"""""""""""""""" Mod pump $750
1.6L pump turbo normal $750
"""""""""""""""" Mod $950
1.9L pump turbo normal $750
"""""""""""""""" Mod $950
Any other things just ask.
hope this helps out[/img]
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So just so I am not misunderstanding this post. You will rebuild the pump, and do all of the mods that dr. d's pump is running for $875.00 CDN??? If this is the case as soon as I can get the pump out of the car it will be in the fedex truck headed your way! I was recently just quoted over $1400.00 for just an overhual at a local fuel injection shop. I will try and call you tomorrow if court doesn't run to late (as I am 3 hours behind you and will be in to much of a rush b4). If not tuesday for sure.
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Assuming Giles' prices are quoted in Candian dollars, that converts to the following approximate US dollar prices (prices rounded to nearest $5US and do not include transport or any applicable Customs Duty).
1.6L pump N/A normal overhaul $600 (approximately $440US)
"""""""""""""""""""""" Mod pump $800 (approximately $585US)
1.6L pump turbo normal $700 (approximately $510US)
"""""""""""""""""""" Mod $875 (approximately $640US)
1.9L pump turbo normal $750 (approximately $550US)
"""""""""""""""""""" Mod $950 (approximately $695US)
By the way, I have purchased numerous items (up to $1600US worth) for my racing team from Canadian suppliers and have never had to pay any Duty, so I doubt there'll be any for "used engine pieces" being sent for servicing.
Furthermore, those prices are about half of what shops in my area quote for routine rebuilds -- with none of Gile's magic worked on them. I know where my pump is going!
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definitely canadian prices
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I love that little delivery bunny!! It's so fun!
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1.6L pump N/A normal overhaul $600 (approximately $440US)
"""""""""""""""""""""" Mod pump $800 (approximately $585US)
1.6L pump turbo normal $700 (approximately $510US)
"""""""""""""""""""" Mod $875 (approximately $640US)
1.9L pump turbo normal $750 (approximately $550US)
"""""""""""""""""""" Mod $950 (approximately $695US)
Bump... I called today and was quoted $950 (as opposed to $875) for the 1.6L TD pump mod.
I wonder what the price is like for the 1.9L pump mod now?
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Probably the same. If you asked for a 1.6L pump capable of high fuel delivery, it'll likely include the 1.9L pump's cam plate, which is fairly expensive.
Also, he's now doing mods that are several stages beyond what was being done when this post was originally written. The course of pump mods continues to evolve! :twisted:
If you have a clear idea of your objective, you can discuss exactly how far you want to go with the pump. He's recently done a couple pumps that were ordered for "max fuel!" and learned afterwards, they were being installed on engines using less than 15 psi boost. Way overkill. I have a feeling that nobody really has a clear idea of just how much fuel he can get these VE pumps putting out. It's a huge increase, and can support 30+ psi! Needless to say, if you're not running that much boost, it's pointless to pay for the mods done to achieve that level.
I guess what I'm trying to say is make sure you know what you want to accomplish before ordering a pump. And don't forget to let him in on it too.
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Probably the same. If you asked for a 1.6L pump capable of high fuel delivery, it'll likely include the 1.9L pump's cam plate, which is fairly expensive.
Also, he's now doing mods that are several stages beyond what was being done when this post was originally written. The course of pump mods continues to evolve! :twisted:
If you have a clear idea of your objective, you can discuss exactly how far you want to go with the pump. He's recently done a couple pumps that were ordered for "max fuel!" and learned afterwards, they were being installed on engines using less than 15 psi boost. Way overkill. I have a feeling that nobody really has a clear idea of just how much fuel he can get these VE pumps putting out. It's a huge increase, and can support 30+ psi! Needless to say, if you're not running that much boost, it's pointless to pay for the mods done to achieve that level.
I guess what I'm trying to say is make sure you know what you want to accomplish before ordering a pump. And don't forget to let him in on it too.
Yes, I clearly outlined my goals for the 1.6TD and that is the quote Giles came up with.
You may be right about evolving pump upgrades since last year. Also, he could be busier working in his shop since last year, making his hours more valuable.
The phone call had to be cut short, but I will call Giles again for a little clarification before sending my pump :)
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So.. how many other people called Giles today?!
I called him too. I am sending him a turbo pump to tweek for my rabbit
when I do the turbo kit. should be great fun!
I was thinking about a personalized plate that says something like
"EAT SOOT"
heheeh
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Has anyone used the 1.9 pump on their 1.6? It seems like the 1.9 pump with the 1.6 LDA would be the best combo....short of sending your pump off to Giles. My turbo 1.6 pump works perfect so it's hard for me to justify dumping ~$700 into it. How much does a 1.9 pump run, anyways?
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I just got my pump back from Giles, Can't wait to get it on and running. I'm in the middle of putting in new rings because the shop that did it the first time 5k miles ago messed up and broke one while installing it. I also had the turbo overhauled and fresh new "checked for accuacy" injectors. Only thing left it to custom build the 2.5 exhaust. Will be interesting to see how it will run after all that. :D
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i dont want blueprint or anything like that. just wanted to see and feel the magic he works on the pumps,
ask Dr.Diesel what he thinks abaut white passat 93 td .
He drove this car several times .
Pump was moded by Giles and timing was done by Dr. Diesel
:P
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So.. how many other people called Giles today?!
I called him too. I am sending him a turbo pump to tweek for my rabbit
when I do the turbo kit. should be great fun!
I was thinking about a personalized plate that says something like
"EAT SOOT"
heheeh
Unfortunately, Texas only allows 6 characters on their plates.
How much is shipping and duties going to cost? I'd like to eventually get new injectors and a "tweaked" pump for my 1.6D N/A so I can at least keep up with the local traffic. An extra 20 or 30 horses would be 8) .
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it was a gain of 22 net hp (which is affected by drag and incline) compared with before the mods. So, if you were to translate that back to crank hp, let's estimate 20%. Make it a gain of 27 crank hp up from 52 is 77 at the flywheel. Not bad for an old rattlebox.
I don't mean to nit-pick the information you have contributed, but because I have seen these results provided to now to various folks considering shelling out big bucks on a Giles rebuilt pump, it is for their sake that I elaborated some concerns about the testing methodology here:
http://www.vwdiesel.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=2978&start=10
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this thread came up top? wonder why...
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this thread came up top? wonder why...
porn :roll:
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Yeah, that darn porn is always making everything rise up. :P
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Yeah, that darn porn is always making everything rise up. :P
:lol:
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20 more hp from a 1.6N/A???
Thatīs impressive :shock:
How much power would a 1.9N/A gain from similar mods?
Maybe Iīll try this instead of turboing my Pickup!
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20 more hp from a 1.6N/A???
Thatīs impressive :shock:
How much power would a 1.9N/A gain from similar mods?
Maybe Iīll try this instead of turboing my Pickup!
but why not turbo and get even more hp? :twisted:
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but why not turbo and get even more hp? :twisted:
Probably because turbos are a pain in the ass :P KISS
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Thatīs one reason, the other is that itīs not legal here, but that isnīt a big deal.
Would be cool to have a fast (-er) N/A diesel :lol:
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Thatīs one reason, the other is that itīs not legal here, but that isnīt a big deal.
Would be cool to have a fast (-er) N/A diesel :lol:
you can't turbo a car that did not come with a turbo? what about swapping for a turbo motor?
turbo's are FUN :twisted:
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Some of those countries over there have ridiculous restrictions or taxes on mods, even for something as mundane as replacing a rusted out frame on an LR with a new one that is exactly the same.
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I canīt get rid of the thought of having a (somewhat) fast n/a diesel truck :lol: Must be something in the water...
Does a diesel engine gain power with a free flowing exhaust manifold and pipe?
Thereīs race headers to buy for Golf gassers :twisted:
Maybe a stock Golf GTI manifold is an improvement too?
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I canīt get rid of the thought of having a (somewhat) fast n/a diesel truck :lol: Must be something in the water...
Does a diesel engine gain power with a free flowing exhaust manifold and pipe?
Thereīs race headers to buy for Golf gassers :twisted:
Maybe a stock Golf GTI manifold is an improvement too?
Do it! A diesel will respond to pretty well anything a gasser will. better manifolds, header, porting etc etc... NITROUS... :twisted:
you can make a quick little N/A truck. I'd love to see it.