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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: mammonista on November 15, 2015, 08:11:36 am
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Hey everybody,
1) What kind of MODERATE hp available, at what rpm, at what boost from my 1.9 AAZ engine currently in 'Van-no-mo'? I'm shooting for 110/120hp.
2) The turbo (not sure what make/model) was rebuilt a long time ago and currently makes no more than 10 pounds at full boost (something may be stuck). Should I plan on replacing?
3) The pump was rebuilt 5 years ago but works well. Do I need to send it somewhere for tweaking?
4) Injector/nozzles need replacing for more HP?
5) I'm currently running an air-to-air IC but plan on replacing it with a water-to-air unit with a front mounted radiator for better cooling...any concerns there?
6) Van-no-mo has an early model DK (air-cooled) trans with 15-inch tires. She runs 3,500 rpms at 68mpg returning 27/28mpg. What changes might I expect?
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/1Frontdriverthreequarter_zpspascibdr.jpg)
I recently bought a MK1 Jetta TD coupe with 3-speed auto. A previous owner blew the turbo motor and replaced with a 1.6 NA diesel and man is this thing slow!!!! I bought a '96 AHU engine / 5-speed trans to swap in. The engine has been fitted with a Rover 300 pump and Bosio 520 injectors. Would that engine be better suited in Van-no-mo and the AAZ engine swapped into the Jetta?
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/jetta_zpsjerdu92z.jpg)
ALL ANSWERS/OPINIONS WELCOMED!
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The AAZ can put out 120 HP fairly easily. The stock turbo and injectors are fine. The pump itself is OK but the LDA pin will need to be swapped over to a 1.6 one. An intercooler of some sort is essentially necessary. You'll be wanting to turn the boost up in to the high teens plus crank up the fuel.
The AHU with the Rover pump will have more potential than the AAZ. Whether you should swap or not, that's another story. You can get decent power from the AAZ without much work though the AHU will yield better fuel economy in the end.
Sent from my XT1097 using Tapatalk
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Thanks Bryn,
Okay ignorance here... "the LDA pin from a 1.6 pump" 1) is that something I can do myself or does it need to go to a shop? 2) source for the pin? (would a pump rebuild shop have one laying around)? 3) Is boost adjustable at the turbo? Like a screw on the wastegate or something? 4) Is boost adjustable at all rpms and throttle openings? as I remember cruising down the highway at partial throttle (3,500 rpms/65-68mpg) showed boost at about 4-5psi. Should that be higher?
Once again many thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!
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The pin is easily changed, there's 4 screws on the top of the pump you undo to get at it.
Pump shops MAY have a pin, but probably not. You'd be best off posting a want ad on the classifieds here. I sold my spare a few months back.
Boost is "sort of" adjustable at the turbo. Ideally you need to buy a manual boost controller - google "NXS Boost Controller" for a reasonably cheap option. It gets plumbed in to the boost hoses going to the wastegate.
Cruising boost with a wastegate turbo is a function of the size of the turbo combined with the load on the engine; nothing you can adjust. The harder the engine is working the higher the cruising boost will be. Nothing you're doing to increase peak power will affect cruising.
Sent from my XT1097 using Tapatalk
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thats an LDA pin from a 1.6 td pump? or any 1.6 pump? is there a difference?
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Non turbo pumps don't have an lda. I'm pretty sure you also want the 1.6td lda cap. The lda is adjustable on the 1.6 pumps and in*most cases* the 1.9l pumps are not adjustable.
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Got 'ya. Thanx evrybody. Now the search is on for the cap/pin.
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boy do i feel like a doofus. first i discover that the 1.6 NA Jetta engine (that will soon be replaced with a mTDI) has a turbo injection pump (from the 1.6TD engine a PO replaced with the NA).
so I already have the LDA pin and cap for installation on the 1.9 AAZ pump.
then i popped the engine lid on 'van-no-mo' and discovered that the pump on the AAZ engine is already a 1.6 td pump!
then i remembered... a long time ago (20 years?) I bought a canadian AAZ crate engine and swapped out the 1.6td i had put in the van from a quantum. I must have used the 1.6 pump on the crate motor.
But even though both are apparently 1.6 pumps, the LDA cap looks somewhat different. Is that an issue? Or am I missing something here?
THIS IS THE PUMP ON THE AAZ ENGINE IN VAN-NO-MO
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/2015-11-24%2014.34.13_zpsz9dvqbyj.jpg)
AND THIS IS THE PUMP IN THE JETTA
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/2015-11-22%2015.52.44_zps3os7osgw.jpg)
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Please excuse my ignorance. Do I need to change my turbo if the end goal is 120hp from my AAZ engine? And if so what's a reasonably inexpensive choice
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/turbo%201_zpsehhthvcw.jpg)
And assuming I stick with this pump is this hooked up correctly?
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/injection%20pump_zpsgxwkputc.jpg)
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Some of the AAZ pumps are visually identical to the 1.6 pump, just FYI. The AAZ pump is a better starting point for power than the 1.6TD one but either will work. Just make sure it actually has the "good" LDA pin. Check the VW part number on the pump, if it starts with '068' then it's a 1.6 pump for sure. I think 028 is the AAZ prefix.
I'm guessing you have a K14 currently? They are a pretty decent turbo though they can't be pushed as hard as say a K24. The general consensus around here is to stick to about 18 PSI with a K14. I think 120 HP is probably achievable with that turbo on an AAZ provided you can figure out a good intercooler solution. An AWIC might be the best way to go in a Vanagon.
Yep, pump is hooked up correctly. There was originally a rubber cover on the vent to help keep junk out of it.
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He Bryn,
Thanks for the info. I'll be checking the numbers on the pumps. Would I be better off just replacing the turbo? I mean the actuator housing is shot. Are those even available anymore?
What would be a good source for a new K24 (assuming those are available) and what would I expect to pay? Would the manifold mounting holes match up with the 1.6 manifold that's on the AAZ or should that be swapped out for something newer?
Mark
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K24 is an old design if your going to buy something newer a vane turbo from a tdi is a good choice but you will have to figure out a way to controll the vanes. A holset he200wg seems to be the best turbo at the moment.
That turbo you have is probably a t2. The Wastegate actuator can be repaired but it's a bit of work. You would need to cut apart the diaphragm housing and remove the spring. Then you would need to find a new diaphragm actuator make some kind of mounting bracket and attach its shaft to the original someway. Definitely not the easiest job but it can be done if you have a welder and a bit of free time. There may be an easier way to attach a new oem actuator but like you said they are probably hard to find and probably expensive.
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That's a T3 from a 1.6TD Quantum or Audi.
As far as the AAZ pump is concerned, it is not just the boost pin, but rather the whole lid. The AAZ lid would need a fair amount of precision machining to use the 1.6TD pin, metal tube, star wheel, spring, etc... Best, IMO, would be to use the AAZ bottom and the entire 1.6TD pump top. That way you keep the AAZ camplate and dynamic advance, but add all of the 1.6TD aneroid functionality.
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well that makes sense as far as the turbo goes, because I think I bought a beater quantum for the td engine, transplanted the engine into the van and then bought the current AAZ engine a few years later and put the turbo and 1.6td pump on it.
1) so can the holset be had without breaking the bank?
2) since I apparently have two 1.6td pumps (the one currently on the AAZ engine) and the one on my MK1 Jetta (that I won't be using as soon as I do the mTDI swap) is either up to the task of fueling the AAZ engine up to its true potential? Obviously the current pump can fuel the engine as I had been using it for years without issue, but maybe I should start with the correct pump in the first place?
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I believe both pumps are similar in the amount of fuel they can deliver. The main difference between the 2 is how they deliver fuel. The Aaz has a more aggressive cam to deal with dual stage injectors. This is a benefit in tuning for more performance. The 1.6td has the more aggressive boost pin which I believe let's it give more fuel earlier on with boost and less smoke off boost. I don't think you would see a major difference between 2 stock pumps. Getting a Giles built pump would be the best option.
I think the holsets go around $650 but you then also need a different exhaust manifold. You would also need to modify your exhaust to meet a custom down pipe and come up with custom oil feed and drain lines. Its not a plug and play swap by any means. It may be tricky to make fit in the engine bay depending on how much space you have.
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what turbo, new or used, would fit the 1.6td exhaust manifold? and space is limited, I think the compressor inlet is about an inch from the van engine support member!
thanks everybody by the way
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There are 2 styles of manifolds a 4 bolt and a 3 bolt. Smaller turbo's use the 3 bolt and the bigger stock turbo's use the 4 bolt. A k14 seems to be the best blend of spooling for medium boost levels. K24 or t3 if you want to run a lot of boost.
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memory is a funny thing...it's been soooooo long ago that I did the original quantum td into the diesel van swap that I kinda forgot. Now I seem to remember that I sourced the quantum as donor car because that flavor 1.6td was oriented north/south in the engine bay and the exhaust manifold outlet was at the end instead of the middle which allowed the turbo to clear the van engine support carriers. does that sound right? it's been almost 15 or 16 years since I did the swap.
so maybe I'm better trying to fix the wastegate actuator housing on the t3. Since van-no-mo is on the heavy side (3,600 lbs.) I'm not particularly interested in a fast spool, and I know this thing will fit if I can just fix it.
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Okay, apparently a K14 is the way to go here. Now the challenge is to find one as inexpensively as possible with the trapezoidal exhaust gas inlet flange. They can be had for $450, rebuilt out of Germany but that seems a bit much. Any ideas?
thanks in advance
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It was never a super common turbo in North America. AAZ cars in Canada would probably be the best bet. Try contacting CanadaCatalyst (they advertise on here)
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Bought a used K14 turbo off German Ebay tonight for $120. Will cost $60 to ship to the states. Once it arrives does it make sense to try to rebuild it, or just run it as is and hope for the best? The seller said it came off a running car and was working as it should...
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If there isnt any excessive shaft play, no signs of oil leaks and the waste gate isnt seized I see no reason to rebuild it.
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okay dumb question here. how to tell if the wastegate is seized?
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You should be able to push it open by hand and it should snap closed when you let go of it.
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gasket between turbo and exhaust manifold? gasket between turbo and exhaust pipe?
thanks in advance for answers
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Yes you want gaskets in those places.
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I do not use a gasket between turbo and manifold or between the turbo and the downpipe. In both cases I use a light smear of Ultra Copper and have never had an exhaust leak in more than a decade of doing so on quite a few vehicles.
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that's what i needed to know! thanks!!!
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My used K14 from Germany arrived in the mail today. Appears to be in excellent condition and I think the cost was very reasonable. $120 for the turbo on German Ebay and $35 to have it shipped to the U.S.
But I do have a couple of questions...
(pic#1) I assume the long 'pipe' is the pressure (inlet) side of the oil lube for the bearings and the outlet side (to the pan) is on the other side of the bearing housing? The only reason I ask is it was exactly opposite on my old T3 turbo...or maybe I just had it plumbed wrong!
The inlet side is a larger diameter hole than the outlet side which makes sense I guess, but if anyone knows for sure I'd appreciate the input.
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/k14%201%20copy_zpsxi2dolqj.jpg)
(pic#2)And can the housing sides be rotated to accommodate different oil pipe and air compressor orientations by loosening the green or blue arrows and is there any downside to that?
thanks in advance!
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/k14%204%20copy_zpscbtcbcfy.jpg)
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Bigger hole is the drain 100% of the time
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But that would put the drain at the top of the bearing housing...and the only way I could re-orient the bearing housing so the drain was pointing down would be to plumb a new wastegate/boost pressure tube.
I'm just guessing here as I have no experience with with whatever German VW or Audi this thing came off of.
Does anyone know is VW/Audi made a model where the mating surface of the exhaust side of the turbo (red arrow) would not point 'up' to meet the downward pointing exhaust manifold? Or do I need to unbolt the bearing housing and turn it 180 degrees so that the oil drain pipe (green arrow) is pointing downward?
Or maybe the oil drain is meant to be at the 'top' of the housing to keep the bearings submerged in oil once the engine is turned off?
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/k14%205%20copy_zpsvdp1aqot.jpg)
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Here is my turbo which is a K24 mounted with the drain going down and the smaller oil feed from the top:
(http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk164/deepgrooves74/Bucket%20Project/Motor%20work/0AE54E6C-0B3C-4E9C-8283-3BBF3EA77A02_zpsyabtwzru.jpg)
(http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk164/deepgrooves74/Bucket%20Project/Motor%20work/3AB70D86-50A8-4230-95D0-6620952233D0_zpsrzmpkiib.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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well that tells me the bearing carrier housing needs to be turned 180 degrees to point the oil drain down instead of up. I should have mentioned this is going in my '87 DIY DOKA using an '84 Quantum TD exhaust manifold where the engine was oriented north/south and the old T3 turbo bolted to the end of the manifold. I just hope the integral wastegate on the K14 clears the exhaust manifold runners.
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well that tells me the bearing carrier housing needs to be turned 180 degrees to point the oil drain down instead of up. I should have mentioned this is going in my '87 DIY DOKA using an '84 Quantum TD exhaust manifold where the engine was oriented north/south and the old T3 turbo bolted to the end of the manifold. I just hope the integral wastegate on the K14 clears the exhaust manifold runners.
I had to heat up the exhaust side, and then hit it with a mallet in order for it to rotate. This was just because when I had my turbo rebuilt they had put it back together with the exhaust side clocked 180° out.
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Anyone out there running this set-up (k14 on a quantum td manifold) on a vanagon? just curious as to whether the wastegate actuator will clear the manifold...
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There are a tremendous number of people in 'other' markets using the K14 on the quantum manifold. Approximately half of all of the vanagons sold in the world came stock that way. You might want to make life easy on yourself and get the stock vanagon 1.6TD oil return line and supply line. If you have the non-turbo pan, you might want to get the turbo version as well so everything is bolt-in.
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Whew, breathing a sigh of relief here. The oil lines shouldn't be a problem and my van diesel pan already has an oil return fitting heliarced into it. So I should be good to go.
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Okay another couple of dumb questions. I'm gonna guess that my NXS boost controller gets plumbed into the the stainless line (green arrows) between the turbo outlet and the wastegate on my K14. Is that right? If so should I just cut the line with a tubing cutter and use short pieces of tubing to connect to the barbs on the actuator? And what the heck does the threaded rod and nut (red arrow) on the actuator adjust?
(http://i1255.photobucket.com/albums/hh622/mammonista/boost%20controller_edited-1_zpsf4padvyf.jpg)
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(http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk164/deepgrooves74/A2A7D8EC-306F-4C46-A20E-D61A2BE89D6C_zpsnhtw7xuy.jpg)
On the wastegate you can adjust the tension against the spring internally. That should change at what pressure the wastegate opens up.
The boost controller slows down how quickly the pressure goes through into the wastegate. That way the turbo will build more boost before the wastegate opens up and dumps it into the exhaust system.
How was my explanation gentlemen?
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Yeah you cut the green line and tap into it.
I'm not 100% sure but the adjustment on top of the actuator I believe is to set the opening pressure. I don't think it offers much adjustment but I'm pretty sure it's how the factory boost level was fine tuned.
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i think the adjustment on the waste gate only adjusts how far the wastegate valve can open, so you can use it to increase maximum boost pressure, but using a mbc is probably the best way to do it, and it increases spool up times.
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Flywheel on...ready to bolt on Kennedy Stage One pressure plate with new clutch disk. Help me out here...I don't seem to remember needing longer pressure plate-to-flywheel bolts the last time I put in a stiffer clutch, but that was 10 years ago and my memory ain't what it used to be. :) The stock bolts seem to be about 1/4" short
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Okay sumpin' ain't right.
I think the flywheel on my 1.9 AAZ (IDI) diesel came off a 1.6 IDI engine from a junkyard Quantum about 15 years ago. When I upgraded to the new Canadian 1.9 engine 10 years ago I just kept the 228mm flywheel and pressure plate. Now I'm upgrading the clutch and going with a Kennedy Engineered Products Stage 1 228mm pressure plate. But their 228mm pressure plate won't fit!
After a trip to the machine shop to clean it up I bolted on the 228mm flywheel that's been on this 1.9 AAZ forever. I slipped on the new 228mm heavy duty clutch disk. But the pressure plate bolt holes don't line up. They're not far enough out from the center when compared with the bolt holes on the flywheel. And the three locating dowels on the flywheel don't line up with the three pressure plate holes either. But the pressure plate is clearly a 228mm unit. Does anyone know if 1.6 IDIs came with different 228mm flywheels than the 1.9 IDIs? Or for that matter did Wasserboxers came with 228mm clutches but with a differently configured flywheel and Kennedy sent me the wrong pressure plate?
HELP?
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The 1.6 never came with anything over a 200mm pp. The 228 is a different plate for a different clutch all together. There is a regular style pp that is 215mm that looks like the 228mm...just buy a new pp that will fit your clutch.
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okay so I had the problem with the 228mm pressure plate not fitting the flywheel that has been on this 1.9 AAZ engine forever. I call Kennedy Engineered Products out in Cali who I ordered the pressure plate from and they tell me it's a 228mm pressure plate for a wasserboxer and won't fit a diesel flywheel. so then I do a little searching and somebody over at Vortex or Samba says what I need is a G60 flywheel and a VR6 pressure plate to go in the Van's DK transaxle. So I quick go on Ebay and order a used G60 flywheel and a new pressure stage 1 plate from some other company (Kennedy doesn't make 'em). So the new(used) flywheel arrives and...it's the same one that was already on the van. >:(
The new pressure plate arrives this week. I sure hope it fits. This is getting old!
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You need the G60/TDI flywheel and pressure plate along with the 228 WBX disc. You need to bend the tabs down on the pressure plate. You often need to grind a little off the starter so it doesn't rub on or lock up the flywheel and you sometimes need to clearance a little in the bell housing depending on the casting.
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Pressure plate arrived. I see the two tabs that need to be bent down (or should I grind them off?), but what would need to be done to the starter? I mean what would the starter interfere with. This is the same starter that was in the van before with the stock pressure plate. All that I've done at this point is swap in a VR6 stage 1 pressure plate for the stock diesel pressure plate.
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I am such a dumb ass (this is why it makes sense to label all the parts when there are two almost identical engines withing 20 feet of each other in the garage)! I mistook my original AAZ flywheel for the TDI flywheel and it all went downhill from there. So at any rate, now that I have the right flywheel on the motor (from a G60) with the right pressure plate (Stage 1 for a VR6) and the right clutch disk (228mm), I slid the trans onto the engine (had to make a custom aluminum dust shield) and everything went together fine. Now the starter needs to be ground down because it's apparently a bit 'long' and then I should be in business!
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The starter is not too long. The casting where it goes around the gear support is a little too thick and it pinches the flywheel. Just grind a bit down here and it will work.
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a269/libbybapa/DV%20Starter_zps791jgbzi.jpg)
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Thanks a bunch. I couldn't figure out where it was binding. I looked at the flywheel (with a mirror) and couldn't figure it out!