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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: hanisbb21 on August 08, 2015, 06:27:59 pm
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I'm writing a short question because I just spent 30 minutes posting pictures and a long write up just to have vwdiesel log me off. Anyways, like the title says. k14 vs T3 turbo. Any input? I have both and am debating on which one to put in my caddy and which 1 to put in my mk1 rabbit.
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I'll write a short response in response to your short question.
fast(ish) off the line = k14
laggy as anything = t3
max boost 15 psi = k14
max boost 25? psi = t3
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Rebuild the T3 with a 360 bearing and it will spool as fast as a K14...if you have a decent downpipe.
I had a T3 that spooled faster than the vnt 15 on tdi's. If you are looking to spend over 800.00 I would go with a holset
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@burn your money. I appreciate the sarcasm. :P And I agree, k14 compressor maps dont suggest that they support higher boost levels effeciently... Although I would like to study this more if anyone has factory specs on these compressors.
@theman. Where would you find a ball bearing rebuild kit? I'll start some searching now but if you know of a reputable place I'd love the input. I just installed an Auber instruments egt probe into the 1.6 TD I'm putting together right now. The first step to IDI tuning ;D... After just blowing up my other 1.6 TD due to ignorance and messing with injection pump timing without and EGT, I won't leave home without one.
AND, BTW, I have a 2.5" exhaust from the downpipe.
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@burn your money. I appreciate the sarcasm. :P And I agree, k14 compressor maps dont suggest that they support higher boost levels effeciently... Although I would like to study this more if anyone has factory specs on these compressors.
@theman. Where would you find a ball bearing rebuild kit? I'll start some searching now but if you know of a reputable place I'd love the input. I just installed an Auber instruments egt probe into the 1.6 TD I'm putting together right now. The first step to IDI tuning ;D... After just blowing up my other 1.6 TD due to ignorance and messing with injection pump timing without and EGT, I won't leave home without one.
AND, BTW, I have a 2.5" exhaust from the downpipe.
I never said ball bearing. I said 360 bearing. Most any reputable shop should have the kit for around 100.00. xsboostturbochargers.com sell them for sure.
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hanisbb21, I'm looking for a good used K14. If you decide to go with the T3 and want to sell the K14, please let me know. Thanks.
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I will definitely keep you in mind. Still debating between keeping the rabbit diesel (keeping the truck diesel of course) or doing an AEB 1.8T swap... I found a donor car for $500 bucks locally. Once I make that decision I'll PM you. FYI, it doesnt have the oil drain tube and finding the fittings is a pain in the arse.
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I'd be installing on a vanagon, so no need for the tube.
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@theman something like this?
http://www.xsboostturbochargers.com/products/t3-t4-dynamic-rebuild-kit/
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Here are some photos of my 81 mk1's. and of the turbos.
K14 (left) vs T3
(http://i448.photobucket.com/albums/qq203/hanisbb21/IMG_20150808_144421_zpsocmcxci7.jpg)
Block after attempting to tune without using an EGT
(http://i448.photobucket.com/albums/qq203/hanisbb21/IMG_20150521_104114_zps5vkxpzvr.jpg)
Cylinder Head carnage
(http://i448.photobucket.com/albums/qq203/hanisbb21/IMG_20150521_103850_zpsenj72plv.jpg)
Rabbit
(http://i448.photobucket.com/albums/qq203/hanisbb21/IMG_20150421_182155_zpsymtnzj5a.jpg)
Caddy
(http://i448.photobucket.com/albums/qq203/hanisbb21/IMG_20150418_234041_zpsxuzqemsv.jpg)
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@theman something like this?
http://www.xsboostturbochargers.com/products/t3-t4-dynamic-rebuild-kit/
Like that only not that one at all. That is the 270 bearing. See the giant hole in the bottom, it is missing 90 degrees of the circle...The 360 is just that 360 degrees of bearing.
Like this one only for our turbo
6-0-powerstroke-gt3782va-360-thrust-upgrade-kit
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So your saying that exact part fits the Garrett T3?
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That head looks harsh, but you could probably replace the two valves, replace the one guide, smooth out the sharp edges on the combustion face and run it. Piston is obviously trash. Is the rod bent or block scored?
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Also, EGTs didn't cause that valve head to break off.
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The rod is bent to ****. Can BARELY spin the engine. There were so many metal chunks in the pan (including the oil squirter) I don't think its salvageable. Plus, I already have the new/used engine back together. Although I'm having a hard time getting a broken bolt out of the water pump bolt holes.
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So your saying that exact part fits the Garrett T3?
I am starting to wonder if you can read. I stated clearly that it is "like that only for our turbo." In other words, no, that says it is for a 6.0 powerstroke and unless they take the same bearing it will not fit. Call around, better yet just send the turbo in and have someone else do it as I think this is way out of your skill range.
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Although I'm having a hard time getting a broken bolt out of the water pump bolt holes.
Is the broken bolt in the block? Get a washer that would fit around the bolt, place it over the broken bolt and weld it to the bolt. You can then use vice grips or a pipe wrench to unspin it.
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That looks like a classic "I broke the timing belt, oh well let's put a new one on without pulling the head... Hey look it runs!" Months later... valve drops its head, destruction ensues...
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So your saying that exact part fits the Garrett T3?
I am starting to wonder if you can read. I stated clearly that it is "like that only for our turbo." In other words, no, that says it is for a 6.0 powerstroke and unless they take the same bearing it will not fit. Call around, better yet just send the turbo in and have someone else do it as I think this is way out of your skill range.
I can read! I just can't read good :-[
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Although I'm having a hard time getting a broken bolt out of the water pump bolt holes.
Is the broken bolt in the block? Get a washer that would fit around the bolt, place it over the broken bolt and weld it to the bolt. You can then use vice grips or a pipe wrench to unspin it.
The bolt was fubar. Im understanding now why I got this setup for so cheap. (missing turbo drain line, 4 broken studs in the intake/exhaust manifold, broken bolt in the water pump housing bolt, and 1 broken nut for the timing belt backing plate). But still, $600 for a turbo longblock with turbo and a tranny (with good clutch), I can't complain.
The good news is, I got that broken bolt out today ;D PAIN IN THE ARSE! Drilled a hole and when I tried using the Easy-out.... SNAP. Broke that sucker off in there. Spent 2 hours grinding, drilling, and digging that mother out. Hopefully its smooth sailing from here on out. And thats a valve thats sitting on the piston.
That looks like a classic "I broke the timing belt, oh well let's put a new one on without pulling the head... Hey look it runs!" Months later... valve drops its head, destruction ensues...
Actually... the bottom end was rebuilt. I just had the head inspected instead of disassembled and properly checked/machined/ valve job performed. I still have no idea how it grenaded. I was cruising at 75 when all of a sudden the engine stopped. I pulled over and checked the timing, it was fine. Just really hard to turn over. Temp was fine the whole trip. The only clue (and maybe a big clue) was that this happened after about 8 hours of driving. And the turbo bolts had worked themselves loose after about 6.5 hours. Now, I suspected EGT because I read that high EGT's can cause cylinder pressures to reach their peak, but I dont know. And when I set injection pump timing I set it REALLY low... thinking it was going to help MPG (and it did 38-40mpg before it blew)I'm up for any theories anyone might have.
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9 times out of 10 that failure happens because a valve got whacked and had its stem damaged. They usually continue to work for a while afterwards - a few thousand miles seems to be the norm - then the stem finally breaks.
Where did the head come from?
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While peak cylinder pressures and peak EGTs may occur at the same time they are not directly related. One can raise/lower EGTs without affecting peak cylinder pressures in the same way and vice versa. Regardless, both valves are closed when cylinder pressures build so the cylinder pressures never act on the valve stem/head junction. You either had a faulty valve or mechanical damage to the valve.
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9 times out of 10 that failure happens because a valve got whacked and had its stem damaged. They usually continue to work for a while afterwards - a few thousand miles seems to be the norm - then the stem finally breaks.
Where did the head come from?
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Stock MF engine code 1.6 TD head.
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I meant the history of that specific head...
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Nope. No history. I bought the used complete motor from a local guy who works at a store called "Vee Parts" and I decided to recondition the bottom end... and now that I think about it (this was 6-7 years ago). I did have a guy do a valve job on it. Who knows if he tested the springs though.
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Was probably a bad valve, a lot of folks are convinced that they won't seal if they are damaged so they never really check them out. Unfortunately you've got a perfect example in front of you.
Well, I bet you make double sure the valves are all good in whatever you build next!
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Next time I rebuild an engine I'm going to really build it. 35 year old parts just won't cut it.