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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: theman53 on July 05, 2013, 07:27:52 pm

Title: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: theman53 on July 05, 2013, 07:27:52 pm: I am putting a 1.9 into a Jeep. I have the spacer template made, but I thought what about the cutout for the starter? Well, now all my holes are wrong. I have another piece I put the VW holes in and used it to "clock" it so that I could see where the starter would have to be. Taking a reading off the 2 centerlines it looks like almost 35 degrees. Is 35 degrees too much to rotate the engine for a transverse mounted oil pan? It is what it is and I have a very small window to get it on there. I still maybe in trouble with the turbo.
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: theman53 on July 05, 2013, 07:29:54 pm: (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachments/jeep-willys/792258d1363138253-rooneys-build-20130312_183103.jpg)

This is HPA solution, don't use the jeep starter, they use a Passat and cut it north of the starter hole...kinda crappy I think.
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: theman53 on July 05, 2013, 07:32:15 pm: (http://img802.imageshack.us/img802/2887/20120422112400.jpg)

This guy built one from scratch like I am doing. It looks like he leaned his the 35 degrees over. I would ask him but the DB won't respond to PM's
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: libbydiesel on July 05, 2013, 07:52:35 pm: Can you tip it 50 degrees and use the vanagon oil pump and pan?
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: theman53 on July 05, 2013, 07:56:13 pm: No, the 33 to maybe 42ish is it, after that the starter hits the top of the block toward the deck.
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: mark peterson on July 05, 2013, 10:11:56 pm: What type of Jeep transmission ?

I am putting a 1.9 in a M422A1. With parts matching, i have just a slight tilt. I used the Acme kit for a toyota bellhousing, then paired with a large Aisin trans pattern 22RE turbo bell housing, and used a AX-15 with the (shorter) toyota R150 input shaft. I almost went with a T176, but would need an adapter that AA makes. The oil pan did require recessing for the IFS diff.

A few pics in the link.
http://g503.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=100&t=223191
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: CrazyAndy on July 06, 2013, 04:02:42 am: I would be inclined to think you are okay. Just put a little bit more oil in the sump until the dipstick reads at the top; that would be enough for me to make sure the pickup isn't starving. Also, remember you're going from transverse to longitudinal, so since your oil pump will be near the 'rear' of the motor, you don't have to worry about hard turns or acceleration starving the pick up. The only thing I would worry about is an overly-steep approach angle downhill.
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: theman53 on July 06, 2013, 04:50:19 am: Quote from: mark peterson on July 05, 2013, 10:11:56 pm
What type of Jeep transmission ?

I am using an NV3550 which is the same bell housing as the ax15. It is basically the NV copy of the ax15. Mine is internal slave cylinder and it is going into a 2002 wrangler.
http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=31586.0
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: theman53 on July 06, 2013, 04:57:25 am: I had a thought of cutting and welding the pick up so it was angled more down and or modifying the oil pan. Also I plan to use a crank scrapper/windage tray oil pan with a block girdle so there will be more oil in the sump. I was thinking of putting baffles on hinges that only open when they are uphill so the pump would hopefully always see oil.

Anyone have a block on an engine stand with an oil pump in it that they could put it around 35 degrees back?
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: libbydiesel on July 06, 2013, 06:43:19 am: I would cut and re-weld the oil pickup. Oil starvation is the only potential issue with it tipped.
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: bbob203 on July 06, 2013, 07:53:52 am: I'm so confused I thought you were putting an aaz modded to tdi into a jeep not an alh?
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: libbydiesel on July 06, 2013, 08:39:15 am: I thought the same thing when I saw that pic, but that's not a pic of his engine.
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: CRSMP5 on July 06, 2013, 10:24:22 am: ;D

shop floor to nice to be his.....
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: theman53 on July 06, 2013, 10:58:45 am: I am modding the aaz to TDI but I am using the 1.6 that ate the precup for a template. It is light :D
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: Gizmoman on July 06, 2013, 11:06:20 am: IMHO, modding the pump pick-up as libby suggested is the simplest fix, but if you mod the pan, you'll bring the oil capacity to spec and could possibly even add a bit if there's room.
Though rare, pumps get replaced, the pan won't.
Title: Re: How much angle is too much for our VW blocks?
Post by: theman53 on July 07, 2013, 07:50:48 am: Since I didn't have internet last night, I used the time to figure out the holes. Messed up and did it again. It is exactly 35 degrees off of level. So I will be able to use the jeep starter as I wanted now. The only issue now is it will probably have to be a top mounted turbo as I think the starter will be in the downpipe or real close to touching it. That is something I cannot figure out with the lexan piece I have the holes in. I will have to have the piece that is 1.5 thick to see if it helps or not.