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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: TonyTDTruck on February 05, 2012, 08:31:27 am
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I'm rebuilding my AAZ that is stock and in in excellent condition. It came with an KKK turbo.
I've been looking at a lot of posts here and now I'm not sure which way to go with a turbo change
and a Giles pump. I want more horse power to push my 91 Syncro VW Transporter around but can't figure out
what options to go with. I'm not sure what stock power the AAZ is. I'm looking for more power but not
some crazy number that will over power the engine and overheat the turbo. It sounds like the Giles pump
is one way to get more power, but what about the turbo and injectors? The turbo looks good as well with some rust
here and there. I have no experience with turbo motors. Originally this truck came with a 1.6TD motor that blow up
on the previous owner. Thanks for the help.
Tony
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Your turbo compressor wheel is ruined.
IMO, K14 is the best bolt-on turbo for the Vanagon/Transporter/T3. The K03/T2 are too small and restrictive and hurt high-end. K24/T3 are too big with added lag and no benefit with when pushing less than 15 psi.
Add a charge cooler. No need to swap injectors.
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Your turbo compressor wheel is ruined.
IMO, K14 is the best bolt-on turbo for the Vanagon/Transporter/T3. The K03/T2 are too small and restrictive and hurt high-end. K24/T3 are too big with added lag and no benefit with when pushing less than 15 psi.
Add a charge cooler. No need to swap injectors.
I agree with libbydiesel. The compressor does not look good. The clearance between the blades and housing is way too big. The k14 turbo is a good choice for a larger vehicle like your Transporter but for a second choice a k03 would also work very well. I find reducing lag in a heavy vehicle to be more important than max power. The injection pump can also be turned up a bit to get a few extra ponies. The stock injectors can push more fuel than the motor can handle. An intercooler and piping would be where I would spend my money.
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Excellent info fellas. I would have never guessed that the turbo was in need of repair. Where is the best place to do a turbo exchange?
Is staying with the stock pump and injectors the way to go instead of a Giles pump mod?
This truck is heavy and speed is not the factor as you guessed. Low end power and maintaining 65mph at 2,800 rpm is where I need to be
when doing moderate climbs. And what is the best inter cooler setup for this motor? Too many questions I know, but it's always best get to as
much info as I can. It's a costly project. The transmission is being geared to push 2,800 to 3,000 rpm at 65mph with 30.5" tires. It truly is
a brick going down the highway. What is a charge cooler?
I looked up charge cooler and came up with intercooler.
Thanks
Tony
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I agree that lag stinks in bigger vehicles and lag is even exacerbated where I live @ 7000' of elevation. I do vanagon turbo diesel conversions as a significant part of my income now and have driven the same engine/vehicle w/ the k14 and the k03 and the overall performance of the k14 was way better. The slight lag off the line was easily offset by the significant increase in power even at the same boost pressures. I like to have my cake and eat it too and so I am the biggest proponent for the VNT turbos provided an adequate vane control is used. I have perfected my own mechanical vane control and my own personal TD engines are both fitted with such. The response and max power of a 1.6TD or 1.9TD with a properly controlled VNT is absolutely incredible compared to any of the stock turbo options.
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Welcome back Libby...
Tonytdtruck, I suggest you look for a used k14 if that's the turbo you plan on running. You can find them gently used between $100-200. I also agree with Libbydiesel about the vnt turbos. They spool so fast and are way more efficient period. I had a k14 on a mechanically controlled TDI and it worked well. I then installed a vnt15 and was blown away at the difference. Setting up a vnt takes some effort but totally worth it in the end. As far as the intercooler, find a place to put one and then find an intercooler that fits. Any intercooler is better than no intercooler imo. Maybe an intercooler from an mk3 TDI might work for you but I really don't have much experience with the Transporter. I'm sure Libbydiesel can shed some light on this.
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It looks like a vnt15 is the way to go. Not sure what vane control does so I will e-mail libby and get more on this vane control. As long as I don't have to hack up the manifold to bolt up this vnt15 I'm for it. It take a lot of patience to customize a set up especially when you're not familiar with it.
What about the Giles pump? I keep hearing 20 more hp and why does that sound good? $950 bucks doesn't sound good but the extra ponies are there at a snap!
Can Giles set up my pump to match my trucks needs? Torque at lower rpm....
So far
-vnt15 turbo.
-intercooler that will fit my truck somehow.
-Giles pump?
Thanks
Tony
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Giles pumps can deliver whatever you need if it is possible for the pump to actually do it. I would say 20hp is low. With adding boost and his standard pump the 1.6 engine should easily be in the 120hp range. It came around 77hp stock TD from the factory. His pump will give you all this with the option for more and do it all with no smoke or very little. You want more port the head and add an intercooler. You will need and EGT gauge and probe. The only probe I recommend is the micro 1000. It can be bought for under 40.00 at aircraft spruce.com. Any gauge that will work with it *Ktype* should be ok. Torque at low rpm will generally be a turbo condition, a Giles pump will help spool anything but a turbo that spools quickly will help most as discussed above.
Another thing to consider. I had a k24 in an mk2 jetta. It would start building boost fairly quickly, but I have a Giles pump, ported head, and 3" exhaust from the turbo back no restrictions. I didn't have a tach when it was running but it would spool the turbo fairly quickly. As best as I can tell with the gear calculator vs engine rpm vs speed, I would start building boost at 1800 *like 1/2psi* and by 3400 ish I would have 22psi in pretty much every gear. I wished for more torque off bottom but once it started to spool it was fun. I guess it really depends on what you have now and where you would like to be with it. If you just want a bit more than what you have the easiest route with the most flexiblitly to add more would be a Giles pump.
BTW, He completely stands behind what he builds. No other pump guy I have ever heard of would take a pump back and fix it up like he did mine at no charge. I will never get another pump but his ever again for this reason alone. The power is amazing, but service it KING.
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The Giles pump is a great investment. The AAZ pump in stock form is very de-tuned, there's no boost fuel enrichment to speak of. Giles adds a real turbo LDA (the UFO-like top section of the pump) and does his mods to the rest of the pump according to what you tell him about your engine and power requirements. You'll want a good intercooler setup, and oil cooling as well, the AAZ puts a lot of heat into the oil when tuned.
Giles has 4 videos showing his test rig and the results of the mods, at idle, part & full fuel... nice setup.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKG_0pbzkrw&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL
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The turbo upgrade to VNT and tuning via Libby is going to be your best primary option to get what you want out of the Transporter. Especially since you do need a new turbo anyway.
The Giles Inj Pump teamed with that, would be pure Transporter creme de la creme.
If your Inj Pump were bad, or Non-TD, then i would have suggested the Giles approach as first base.
Intercooled full range Boost is a greater power than Master Modified fueling - if you can only have one. If you can afford both - then by all means do so.
Libby has helped more folks than Bayer aspirin, don't let his new post count appear as a rookie contributor.
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Wow excellent information everybody. I have sent Libby a pm and I will be getting his help with setting up this vnt turbo. The videos of Giles and his shop are impressive. Good to see a pro at work modifying these pumps.
Syncroincity: With the engine way in the back, where would a cooler work best? This is also a challenge for the intercooler as well. I saw an intercooler with an electric fan that is used for a radiator. Does this work ok and a fan for the oil cooler as well? I can't imagine oil lines going to the front of the truck and back.
Baron: I'm not sure what this means ( Intercooled full range Boost is a greater power than Master Modified fueling ) but I'm sure I'll figure it out.
I have sent Giles a picture of the pump and some info about what I plan on doing as far as power. The main goal is torque at lower rpm, but hills around Oregon can present a problem when climbing at 3,000 to 4,000 rpm.
Libby: Where do you buy this vnt15 turbo?
I have been working on carrier bars for these Vans and trucks. Here is my add on Samba in case someone needs a set. You never know.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1253156
Thanks
Tony
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The stock integral manifold VNT15 from the ALH is an extreme interference with the driver's side mounting bracket and would need to be re-clocked for use in a vanagon. Drainage would also be an issue with it mounted that low and the engine tipped to 50°. I used the Euro separate manifold VNT15 on mine. You might want the VNT17. I've used both and the difference in spool time is negligible, but the VNT17 is less labored @ higher boost. I built an spacer/adapter that fits between the trapezoidal manifold and the aforementioned turbo and mounts the turbo so there is no interference, drainage is maximized and the stock turbo is properly clocked. I actually built a jig to reproduce that adapter. Best bet on sourcing a turbo is German eBay. Make sure they ship worldwide and accept Paypal.
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You are correct about the interference libby with the turbo and the carrier bar. The turbo on the original 1.6TD is mounted to the rear of the engine, or towards the front of the truck giving it plenty of room for it to fit when tilted over at 50deg. With these issues in mind I'm thinking about the stock K14 that it came with. The Giles pump and some head porting should get me plenty of power to get this brick going down the road. Today I decided to go with a 4.86 R&P giving me 65mph at around 3,000 rpm. It sounds like a lot of rpm but not when you're pushing a loaded truck with camping gear and towing a small boat.
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Coolers are a source of much debate... ;) Personally, I'm putting it up front, along with an air-water intercooler system. If you keep it in the rear, you need to channel the air flow, and certainly include an electric fan. Many guys have opened up the platform behind the tail light and used the fan to force air thru a horizontal cooler and out the bottom. There's several good threads on thesamba.com about oil cooler placement...
The guys at Brickwerks in the UK swear by front placement; no fan needed, just lots of hose to run. Makes changing the oil a little more challenging too.
Whatever your preference, make sure you include an oil thermostat in the circuit to prevent over-cooling. I found all of the components for my system at Summit Racing. Permacool seems to be the most reasonably-priced stuff. I also am setting up a remote dual-filter oil filtration rig, to include the Amsoil 2-micron bypass filter. I reproduced their $300 remote bypass rig for about $50, using a cool little filter adapter I found on Ebay. :D
EBAY LINKY (http://www.ebay.com/itm/AMSOIL-EaBP-90-100-110-PH3976A-Oil-Filter-Converter-1-16-X-3-4-16-Bypass-2u-FM-/360430880570?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item53eb5ac73a)
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It looks like a vnt15 is the way to go. Not sure what vane control does so I will e-mail libby and get more on this vane control. As long as I don't have to hack up the manifold to bolt up this vnt15 I'm for it. It take a lot of patience to customize a set up especially when you're not familiar with it.
What about the Giles pump? I keep hearing 20 more hp and why does that sound good? $950 bucks doesn't sound good but the extra ponies are there at a snap!
Can Giles set up my pump to match my trucks needs? Torque at lower rpm....
So far
-vnt15 turbo.
-intercooler that will fit my truck somehow.
-Giles pump?
Thanks
Tony
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if your going for performance, avoid a VNT..
ask me how i know.. i will supply you with pics of what happens when you ask too much of a VNT..
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I don't like the stock vanagon turbo mounting location. Poor drainage and sensitive location. I definitely prefer modifying the driver's side bracket and using the transverse manifold if going with the K14. If replacing the K14, be sure to get one for an AAZ and NOT one for a 1.6TD. The compressor wheel on the AAZ version is larger. As I said in my initial post, IMO the k14 is the best "bolt-on" turbo for the AAZ in a vanagon.
Cutting out the bottom of the D-pillar and venting to the wheel well is a bad idea, IMO. I have heard of many individuals doing that and anyone who has posted results have been mediocre at best. The back of the wheel well is a positive pressure area and ducting there from the positive pressure area of the D-pillar louvers results in stagnant flow. I have had very good results venting into the engine compartment or ducting to louvers on the sides of the license plate door, both of which are significant low pressure areas and result in very good flow from the positive pressure D-pillar louvers.
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It does look like I'm staying with the K14 for now. I don't have the resources to find a mount and transverse intake manifold especially since I don't know much about this setup.
This turbo came with the AAZ motor. Or the motor came with this turbo. The AAZ block has a return line going to the block for the turbo. The oil pan is for a 50deg setup and it too has a hole for a return. The 1.6TD probably doesn't have a hole in the block for the return line. Which one would work better? The lines are different. See the picture with the two options.
I'm sourcing a repair shop for the turbo and I will e-mail Giles on Monday asking about tuning up the pump.
Great input on the cooling radiators. I do like the idea of mounting the oil cooler up front. It looks like a lot of hose to front and back. At this distance, what type of pressure hose should I use? The intercooler will mount in the engine compartment some how. I don't want to cut any panels beings that this truck is original and in good shape.
These things are expensive I'm figuring out. I can't imagine what the intercooler setup is going to run.
Can a fan be mounted on the intercooler?
Thanks again for all of the input.
Tony
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Oil return is a pain in the tucchus on these motors in the Transporter... I plugged up that block bung (Greaseworks has a plug for it) and am using the TD oil pan return; when it's mounted over at 50*, the block return hole is almost an uphill run. You have to cobble together a return line long enough... the AAZ is taller than the 1.6 motors, so even a vanagon TD return line is too short. I got hold of an extension hose from Brickwerks for mine. If you have access to a hydraulic shop the easiest thing would be to have a return line made up...
...and just to reiterate; that K-14 lives right where your left aluminum motor mount wants to be... the problem is the wastegate. Something needs to be modified. AFAIK the T2 Passat turbo is the only original AAZ snail that actually clears the motor mount, and even that needs to be shaved down a bit.
Beautiful pan... :o Powder coated?
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K03 fits without any interference on the AAZ. I haven't used a T2, but saw it mounted on an AAZ and couldn't see anything modified.
On my AHU using the TD oil pan, I teed the oil return line to both the block and the pan. It has a consistent downhill run to the pan and at the tee it goes uphill to the block. I figure the tee eliminates the possibility of crank pressure pushing oil up into the turbo from the pan.
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My intention was to use the 1.6TD exhaust manifold. I thought it would clear the mount, but the AAZ turbo doesn't like the 1.6TD manifold. The oil return line hits the manifold.
If I use the AAZ manifold, this can present a problem with the aluminum mount. Do you recommend using the AAZ manifold with the center exhaust port?
How is the K03 compatible with the K14? If it's equal I don't have any problem going with that.
In this picture, you can see the aluminum mount. The cylinder head is at the machine shop still. Otherwise it would be mounted and I could check for interference.
Yep it's powder coated. I have the motor mounts, brackets, intake manifold and valve cover powder coated red as well. It looks nice but it also protects it from corrosion.
Thanks
Tony
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I see another issue with using the 1.6TD manifold with the K-14; it's going to mount your turbo backwards, with the exhaust facing the rear of the van. Nothing insurmountable, if you're going to build your own intake & exhaust plumbing, but forget using any factory pipes.
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The quantum/vanagon exhaust manifold will work. It has the exhaust going toward the front of the van. A weird custom intake tube is needed to go around the carrier bar, but that part should be stock on your van already.
Here's my dissertation on the bolt-on turbo options:
Appropriately sizing a turbo to a specific engine in a specific vehicle is complicated. A turbo that is small will spool very quickly and yet is small enough that it can be a bit restrictive, potentially hurting high-rpm performance. A turbo that is large will have significant lag where no boost at all is developed. When the larger turbo hits its "boost threshold" it will start creating boost and will quickly rise to whatever boost pressure is being regulated by the turbo wastegate. The larger turbo flows much better at higher rpms than a small turbo and so is less of an exhaust restriction and will give better high-rpm performance. The decision of what turbo is best is very subjective. Many people hate turbo lag and so want a smaller turbo. Many people don't mind the lag and prefer the bigger punch when the turbo spools and find the better high-rpm performance desirable.
With regard to specifically the vanagon, I have always preferred to have more boost in the lower rpms in order to help get the big box moving. I don't tend to rev it high and so having the boost at lower rpms is important. The other factor to consider with the vanagon installation is whether or not the turbo interferes with any of the engine mounting components and what work is necessary to eliminate that interference. There were basically 5 different turbo-chargers used on the 1.6TD and 1.9TD engines. They were the T3, K24, K14, T2, and K03.
The T3 and K24 have the same boost characteristics and are both just plain too large for the 1.6TD in a vanagon. Boost doesn't start until about 3,000-3,500 rpms and you can literally get stuck in 2nd gear on moderate grades and even if you rev it to the limit, you cannot shift fast enough to be above the boost threshold in 3rd and without any boost you cannot accelerate. This effect is most apparent at higher altitudes, but those turbos are irritating even at lower altitudes. The K24 and T3 also both severely interfere with the driver's side mounting bracket.
The T2 and K03 are the smallest of the 5 turbos and share the same boost characteristics as each other. Their boost threshold is below idle and so you will see basically instant boost when letting the clutch out. Full boost is developed by 2,000 rpms. They don't ever give the punch of the larger turbos because they are always developing some boost. They do restrict the exhaust more than the larger turbos and so comparatively hurt high-rpm power some.
The last option is the K14. It is middle-of-the-road as far as size is concerned. It is a much better turbo than the K24 and T3. It flows as well as the larger ones at higher rpms and yet spools at least 1,000 rpms sooner. There is some lag, but you definitely feel the boost kick in more than with the k03. The K14 flows better at high-rpms than the K03. The K14 is a significant interference with the driver's side mounting bracket.
To me the slight lag of the k14 is offset by the added punch and better high-end performance. Making the mounting bracket work is a bit of added work, tho. Easiest is to chop off the nose of the bracket and add a piece of 3/8" steel to the bottom and lowering the front of the carrier bar by adding a 3/4" spacer.
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arent all VW turbo manifolds going to point the turbo outlet towards the front of the van? since the vanagon never came standard as a TD vehicle?
(ive seen a TD vanagon, and didnt know how rare they were until i learned a little more about them, and i KNOW it was turbo charged, because i was driving my GTI, and it was SCREAMIN when it went by. sounded more like my turbo diesel with the VNT turbo and open downpipe, than a vanagon.. i didnt see it at first, just heard the turbo, and i could tell WITHOUT A DOUBT, that it was a VW turbo diesel coming up the road. i honestly thought someone stole my rabbit, and i was going to see it driving by.. but no, i turn around, look, and its a big white westy Vanagon!)
now, knowing what i know, if i were to do it over again, i would have waved the driver down, and had him stop so i could check out his ride.. it was SUPER CLEAN, so i imagine the swap was equally clean.
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Appropriately sizing a turbo to a specific engine in a specific vehicle is complicated. A turbo that is small will spool very quickly and yet is small enough that it can be a bit restrictive, potentially hurting high-rpm performance. A turbo that is large will have significant lag where no boost at all is developed. When the larger turbo hits its "boost threshold" it will start creating boost and will quickly rise to whatever boost pressure is being regulated by the turbo wastegate. The larger turbo flows much better at higher rpms than a small turbo and so is less of an exhaust restriction and will give better high-rpm performance. The decision of what turbo is best is very subjective. Many people hate turbo lag and so want a smaller turbo. Many people don't mind the lag and prefer the bigger punch when the turbo spools and find the better high-rpm performance desirable.
With regard to specifically the vanagon, I have always preferred to have more boost in the lower rpms in order to help get the big box moving. I don't tend to rev it high and so having the boost at lower rpms is important. The other factor to consider with the vanagon installation is whether or not the turbo interferes with any of the engine mounting components and what work is necessary to eliminate that interference. There were basically 5 different turbo-chargers used on the 1.6TD and 1.9TD engines. They were the T3, K24, K14, T2, and K03.
The T3 and K24 have the same boost characteristics and are both just plain too large for the 1.6TD in a vanagon. Boost doesn't start until about 3,000-3,500 rpms and you can literally get stuck in 2nd gear on moderate grades and even if you rev it to the limit, you cannot shift fast enough to be above the boost threshold in 3rd and without any boost you cannot accelerate. This effect is most apparent at higher altitudes, but those turbos are irritating even at lower altitudes. The K24 and T3 also both severely interfere with the driver's side mounting bracket.
The T2 and K03 are the smallest of the 5 turbos and share the same boost characteristics as each other. Their boost threshold is below idle and so you will see basically instant boost when letting the clutch out. Full boost is developed by 2,000 rpms. They don't ever give the punch of the larger turbos because they are always developing some boost. They do restrict the exhaust more than the larger turbos and so comparatively hurt high-rpm power some.
The last option is the K14. It is middle-of-the-road as far as size is concerned. It is a much better turbo than the K24 and T3. It flows as well as the larger ones at higher rpms and yet spools at least 1,000 rpms sooner. There is some lag, but you definitely feel the boost kick in more than with the k03. The K14 flows better at high-rpms than the K03. The K14 is a significant interference with the driver's side mounting bracket.
To me the slight lag of the k14 is offset by the added punch and better high-end performance. Making the mounting bracket work is a bit of added work, tho. Easiest is to chop off the nose of the bracket and add a piece of 3/8" steel to the bottom and lowering the front of the carrier bar by adding a 3/4" spacer.
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thought the K03 was the smallest by far, and then the T2/K14 were a bit better, and about identical performers?
but you say the K03 and T2 are closer in characteristics than the T2 and K14? ive always thought the K24 and T3 performed similarly, along with the K14 and T2 performing similarly? and then the K03 was just a tiny little insta-spooler with big top end restrictions?
anyways, im not trying to argue, i genuinely want to know whats right is all, and i know you have ALOT more knowledge than i do, about the subject..
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You may be right. The T2 is the only one of the five that I have not personally owned and installed on a vehicle and so my experience with them is limited. If they are closer in performance to the K14, then I am more interested in them, especially if they do not interfere as severely with the driver's side bracket.
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Okay turbo experts. I wish I knew more about it so I could get in the middle. From the looks of things, the K14 is the best option for this truck project. The exhaust manifold that came with the AAZ is the best way to go If I want the performance the K14 has to offer. As I mentioned before and in the pictures , you can see the 1.6TD manifold just doesn't like the turbo. I will be doing all of the exhaust and intake custom. A friend knows a guy who welds aluminum intake pipes.
Libby: Good to know about the tee for the return like. I'll have to take a look at that. What Quantum motor and year does this manifold come from? I will surely take a look at that. I should have the cylinder head back from the shop this week so I can mount it to start checking things.
If I have to mod the driver side mount I will. Grease Works has a TDI mount that clears the turbo on that setup. I also like the metal bracket mod that helps to clear the turbo. Some pictures of this mounted on a van would be very helpful. I know it would be different than my setup but at least I can see what's going on.
Do I have it right? The K14 with the AAZ manifold? Driver side mount modified? Custom intake and exhaust? Oil cooler to the front and intercooler in the engine compartment someplace?
I found a turbo shop in Corvallis Oregon called Bell Turbos. Pius is his name. He said he could rebuild it with German parts. Pius called it a pop-it valve of a sort. On most turbos this is external with a rod pulling a lever. I said okay.
Thanks
Tony
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You can, and in fact should, clock (rotate) the center section of the turbo so that when it is installed in the vehicle, the oil inlet is at 12:00 and the outlet @ 6:00. That will alleviate the manifold interference. Regardless, to clock the turbo properly when installed, you will need to remove the oil return pipe. Best approach, IMO, is to use a banjo bolt and fitting in it's place and run a custom oil line off of the banjo fitting.
Here are the best pictures I have of the modded bracket:
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a269/libbybapa/flipped.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a269/libbybapa/IMG_1590.jpg)
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Libby,
Is that a 1/2" x 2" bar? It looks really stout from the picture. Rotating the turbo center section is a good idea. When I receive the cylinder head, I will mount the manifolds and post pictures.
Great info.
Thanks again.
Tony
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If memory serves, it was 3/8", but I did that bracket mod about a decade ago.
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You can, and in fact should, clock (rotate) the center section of the turbo so that when it is installed in the vehicle, the oil inlet is at 12:00 and the outlet @ 6:00. That will alleviate the manifold interference. Regardless, to clock the turbo properly when installed, you will need to remove the oil return pipe. Best approach, IMO, is to use a banjo bolt and fitting in it's place and run a custom oil line off of the banjo fitting.
Here are the best pictures I have of the modded bracket:
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a269/libbybapa/flipped.jpg)
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a269/libbybapa/IMG_1590.jpg)
is that an ENGINE MOUNT? i would be TERRIFIED to run that on my car..
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It was/is stronger than the original part. I can't help you with your fears.
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Hey R.O.R-2.0,
Libby is correct. The aluminum brace at that point is weaker. The new 3/8" bar runs down the mount making the whole mount stronger, not only the extended portion that was added.
Especially if the aluminum mount has corrosion like mine does.
I have a question regarding the pulleys for this AAZ. Here in the pictures you see my setup with an A/C. I'm removing the A/C compressor and now I find the pulley situation a bit different. Syncroincity has his AAZ with no A/C and I see in his build where his water pump has a different pulley. Does anybody have the p/n for this water pump pulley? And will I need anything else? My truck doesn't have P/S so I don't need that pulley.
Bentley shows this pulley as well.
Thanks for the help
Tony
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way cool!! its a cutaway of the oval piston diesel that never made production!!!
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