VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.
General Information => Troubleshooting => Topic started by: ORCoaster on January 08, 2012, 05:16:30 pm
-
What causes fuel injectors to tick? Mine was doing that after I checked the compression yesterday. Then as I was running around town and the heat of the engine went up to where the fan kicked on one injector, # 1 I think, really started clacking and I was blowing blue smoke out the back. I have since brought it home, got it to clacking by raising the RPMs. Once I get it there if I release the nut on top the injectors the clack goes away and the idle gets kind of rough. Blue smoke rolls at that point.
I pulled the injector and double checked the heatshield fitment and put it back together. Got it to quiet down but it may get it back if the temperature goes up again.
Any ideas what causes injector clack? Is it timing? If so why wouldn't the other three be doing it?
-
Injectors don't always wear evenly so that one may have a different opening pressure than the others.
Since it happened after you were messing with the injectors a piece of junk may be causing the needle to stick under certain conditions. A good hard drive may clear it out, but it may also explode your motor if something is really wrong (unlikely though).
-
Well, later this week I need to head south for 225 miles and I was hoping not to blow something up on the way.
So something is inside the injector? Could I just take it apart and blow it all off with air? or is it down in the bottom of the injector? I have seen the exploded diagrams of these injectors. Doesn't look complex at all.
Why would the engine smoke visibly when clacking like it was if less fuel is going into the cylinder than required? Just not firing any of it if the right amount isn't in place?
And the compression test was perfect too. Well always something on these bunnies isn't it.
-
Why would the engine smoke visibly when clacking like it was if less fuel is going into the cylinder than required? Just not firing any of it if the right amount isn't in place?
It is smoking because something is inhibiting the injector from atomizing the fuel correctly, and that cylinder is not performing 100% combustion.
-
OK, makes sense. If it is not opening correctly and pissing a stream in there I can understand why it isn't burning right and clacking like that. I might have to up the ATF in the fuel mix in the future to clean these out better. I just put them on 6 mths ago and they looked pretty dirty. Maybe some other reason for that. I did have it retarded to about 78 mm until just recently when I got the dial gauge.
-
It would not hurt to run it straight on ATF, it has been known to help a lot.
ATF has some incredible cleansers and detergents in it.
-
That is why I run it in the fuel then at the end of an oil change. I think you do the same.
So why doesn't it come out of our coveralls?
-
Why would the engine smoke visibly when clacking like it was if less fuel is going into the cylinder than required? Just not firing any of it if the right amount isn't in place?
It is smoking because something is inhibiting the injector from atomizing the fuel correctly, and that cylinder is not performing 100% combustion.
Another possibility is a piece of dirt is holding the needle open and fuel is being injected during all 4 cycles of that cylinder.
-
That is why I run it in the fuel then at the end of an oil change. I think you do the same.
So why doesn't it come out of our coveralls?
I run ATF whenever I think it needs a good cleaning, not all the time though. I generally run either the grey or white Power Service depending on season.
IT stays in the cotton fibers of our coveralls to provide a long lasting forever clean! lol
-
Say there was a piece of dirt or more likely return hose that dropped down in there, could I put a vacuum on it and suck it out?
At idle there is no clack, Rev high and it started, cracked the nut on top to relieve pressure and it stops. Goes back to doing it when I revvved it up again.
Is there any calibration that will be ruined by taking it apart? I didn't think so but want to check that as I don't have a pop tester. Does the needle come out or is that another sealed unit of some sort?
Found replacements for 15 each but won't have time to get before I need to drive. Might look local, Diesel Injectors (?) just up the road.
-
I'd try a can of dieselpurge first
-
I'd try a can of dieselpurge first
good call!
-
Purge it is, Besides that is something I can do in the dark on the street in front of the house with a flashlight. All before I go for the long drive. Thanks
-
You won't be able to suck anything out of the injector. I would pull it and take it apart, clean and blow everything out with compressed air and reinstall. You won't screw anything up (worse) this way as far as calibration unless you don't put it back together properly.
-
Thanks, this too can be done in the street with a flashlight before the need to drive it long.
-
Well, not really. You need a vise to split the injector halves. And it would really suck to have a injector shim fall down a sewer. :'(
-
and a really good clean area to be reassembling the injector in! I like the dining room :D
-
Going to flip the injector in the deep 27 mm socket connected to the breaker bar. Then use an open end on the flats of the upper portion. I do park within shim rolling distance of the sewer so I best take this part of the operation inside. But not on the dining room table. More like the coffee table. Efficiency apartment setup. Not exactly your uncles shop but I think I would at least be able to find a piece of rubber hose if it was in there.
thanks guys. DAS
-
My IDI started to smoke more at the cold start up and clack a little louder, I just thought it was the cold and the injectors have almost 40,000 miles on them...it turned out #3 precup fell into the cylinder. I couldn't even tell as it just seemed a shade different. The last trip it did seem a bit down on power, but I had just swapped a n/a pump for my TD one.
I don't want to scare you, but just give you something to look for if the injector isn't it. Also if the injector is it, it maybe putting a lot of stress on that precup. I hope it is not.
-
My IDI started to smoke more at the cold start up and clack a little louder, I just thought it was the cold and the injectors have almost 40,000 miles on them...it turned out #3 precup fell into the cylinder. I couldn't even tell as it just seemed a shade different. The last trip it did seem a bit down on power, but I had just swapped a n/a pump for my TD one.
I don't want to scare you, but just give you something to look for if the injector isn't it. Also if the injector is it, it maybe putting a lot of stress on that precup. I hope it is not.
yup, could be a precup rattling, trying to break free and destroy your engine..
-
My IDI started to smoke more at the cold start up and clack a little louder, I just thought it was the cold and the injectors have almost 40,000 miles on them...it turned out #3 precup fell into the cylinder. I couldn't even tell as it just seemed a shade different. The last trip it did seem a bit down on power, but I had just swapped a n/a pump for my TD one.
I don't want to scare you, but just give you something to look for if the injector isn't it. Also if the injector is it, it maybe putting a lot of stress on that precup. I hope it is not.
could be a precup rattling, trying to break free and destroy your engine..
Ummm, did you actually read the first sentence completely before posting???? :o
-
yup, long time ago..
"What causes fuel injectors to tick?"
why are you even asking if i read anything? i dont get it..
-
Not MY first sentence. The one in the quote that TMan says he had #3 cyl. drop a pre cup into his engine. That sentence, a bit of a run on but still clearly within the first . .
-
First, I would swap injectors around. If the problem follows the injector, it's the injector. If it doesn't, it's the pump or the engine.
You can not take the injector apart in the street with a flashlight and expect to find something. The piece of dirt would likely be microscopic that is holding the needle, if that even is the problem. Also, if there is ANY rust on the injector, even anything that looks like rust, by taking it apart you are increasing the likelihood of creating a bigger problem. Bring the injector to the diesel shop and ask them to test it. It probably won't cost you a penny. While they are testing it, if they pump really hard they will/can flush out the injector and that might fix your problem. I'm not trying to rain on your parade but opening up the injector is probably just going to cause you headaches.
-
Not MY first sentence. The one in the quote that TMan says he had #3 cyl. drop a pre cup into his engine. That sentence, a bit of a run on but still clearly within the first . .
i was more just confirming the possibility of what he said.. not re-iterating it, or repeating it..
-
B_Y_M I would have to drive said vehicle to the shop across town with the clacking all the way. Which may have to happen if initial investigation proves not to find anything. I don't have a spare injector just to swap in there. Perhaps that is something I should think about as I look through the Craig list ads for auto parts.
Have time tonight to look into this, with or without the flashlight. Even dug out my 10X lens.
-
B_Y_M I would have to drive said vehicle to the shop across town with the clacking all the way. Which may have to happen if initial investigation proves not to find anything. I don't have a spare injector just to swap in there. Perhaps that is something I should think about as I look through the Craig list ads for auto parts.
Have time tonight to look into this, with or without the flashlight. Even dug out my 10X lens.
if you need a working injector, i have a few sets that i pulled from running/decent sounding engines.. there not new by any means, but they work..
-
I need to be road worthy by Friday noon. So I will see what I can do to solve this nasty occurance of fate tonight. If I come up scratching my head I may need to take time off from work and run up to the Diesel folks, and get the injector tested and repaired. But I think having the spare is a good option. Thanks for the offer. Can you deliver like the pizza guy.
Ah not necessary. We can do a PM and solve the logistics.
-
Well when you're good you're good and when you're not you're like me.
I did manage to get the injector apart. Yes far enough from the sewer that dropping parts was not an issue. Put it all back together and ran it for a few miles up and down the road. No more clacking at just off idle. Have to see how this holds on the 4+ hr drive home.
Thanks for the feedback, will try some purge and continue with the ATF in the fuel and hope someday to meet up with R.O.R. for a spare injector and a good time.
DAS
-
Good to hear it was a success :)