VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.
Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: tskm2 on February 22, 2011, 12:46:41 pm
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now i start new build engine setup
convert 1.6 n/a to 1.6 td
setup:
k03 with manifold (and i have t3 mint with is manifold too)
1.6 td intake
custom oil feed line and return to the oil pan
fmic (wait for piping)
external engine oil cooler
and custom big exhaust line (after engine is finish)
n/a oil pump (but probably change for big one td)
ans no oil squirter
but i would run the N/A pump for my setup, i have one mint in storage box, what the best easy mod for this pump?
some people run the N/A pump but nothing speak what mod is put on, i would run the stock boost on my setup (7psi) or bit up
thanks
maxime
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The Ecodiesel was a turbo diesel motor with an NA pump. The only other difference was the pump utilized a 8mm plunger (I think its the plunger) vs the NA/Turbo that used a 9mm. So yes, you can do this. It will be a clean burning diesel engine, and yes, you will have a power gain out of it just not as much as if it were a turbo pump.
The turbo pumps have a diaphram that responds to boost from the turbo and increases fueling based on boost. At least, this is how I understand it to work.
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Yes I know, but I wonder if there would be a good mod has to bring on the N/A pump for better power range, quick power
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Governor mod/advance spring mod comes to mind. There is only so much you can do to an NA pump. There is also Giles, who could build you an NA super pump, but he's going to tell you if you want real power with a turbo motor to use a turbo pump, although I did ask him about using an NA super pump on a turbo motor and he said it would be an extremely clean efficient engine with decent power.
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you have link for the advance spring mod? ou is the same to de governor mod
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I don't have the link available but if you use the forum's search function for governor mod and advance spring mod you should find a myriad of information on both. Im pretty sure they may even be stickies in one of the forums.
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ok i find! thanks
and for oil pump? with D one, its good to drive this setup, or need abselutly one from TD ?
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The link in my SIG, I compiled all the best ideas for a Governor Mod.
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just do the governor mod and turn up the fueling slightly, an na pump can put out the same amount of fuel as a td pump, td pumps just limit fueling off boost.
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i would run the TD oil pump, it has 36mm gears instead of 30s.
and you basically have the same basic build as what i drive around every day..
i got nothing more than a n/a fuel pump.
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thanks all!
i post some pic in my build up progress, now i search for pickup a 36mm oilpump from td to test it in my D block
maxime
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for the EXACT mod for the advance spring timing...any have a link for diy ?
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you should worry about modifying something else before the timing spring.. you arent gonna notice much, if any difference unless you have some other supporting mods too..
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and for mod to governor? ist a good mod or not? because this engine dot not rev up to 4000-4500rpm..
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Doing the governor mod will allow this engine to reach rpms capable of floating valves, and rollers in the pump... 5800+ easy.
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so the best is just run stock n/a pump with only good setting on fuel screw-idle screw, for set the best engine mix/run with good EGT temp
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I have been running a TD oil pump in my NA and saw the oil pressures jump up to 80 psi when cold and any time I'm above 2000 rpm. I too found a turbo setup at the yard and slapped it on my NA with great success. I get better milage and more power. Only a few psi if I don't add extra fuel and about 7 psi with less than half a turn of the of the fuel screw. It has been a great addition and now I can make it up most grades without down shifting. I have only once been able to getthe EGTs upto 1200, that was with a full load of firewood and camping gear climbing a constant 4000' climb to a campsite.
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yea, with the governor basically eliminated, it will spin up close to 6000 rpms..
but it wont make any power up there..
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ok thanks!
for the head gasket.. run wath type?
2 or 3 nutch?
stock 1.6D gasket or from 1.6TD ?
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ok thanks!
for the head gasket.. run wath type?
2 or 3 nutch?
stock 1.6D gasket or from 1.6TD ?
whatever gasket the engine calls for.. its stupidly easy to measure piston protrusion..
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so any head gasket i put its good?
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You need to measure the piston protrusion above the deck to see what gasket you need. Using the wrong gasket can alter compression, however slightly, but its always good to check and make sure before you buy a gasket to make sure you get the right thickness.
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and the good range measure is?
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What do you mean, the good range measure? Every engine is different; you will have to measure yours, then look the table up in the Bentley manual or other online sources to find out which gasket you need based on the measurement you take.
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for the timing engine.
are you have special spec, or only time with the td spec?
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n/a 1.6's have one timing spec
TD 1.6's have a higher spec
and n/a 1.5's have an even higher spec
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alrigth
so i time it to td spec. i remove the head this week to install the setup
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what injectors do you have?
that really determines what spec you should time it to..
theres 130/135bar injectors
and 155bar injectors
and 180bar injectors, but i doubt you have these, cause they only came in early 1.5Ds
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I have 2 set from 130bar from ME
but i look to rebuilt one set ,with stock nozzle, or gtd...its a dilema
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so you have n/a injectors, and a n/a pump now too.. set it to around .95mm for timing..
unless your gonna be trying to make lots of power (and it doesnt seem like you are) then just leave the stock nozzles in there.. they flow way more than enough fuel for a 1.6D
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ok thx, for this year, just i try to ride safety with is setup, for next year that need put gradually more power on it, if the setup is reliable this year
little question about external oil cooler. i want to by the one of this:
1- "Derale 15605" complete kit (with cooler, oil line, fiting, sandwichplate)
2- "Derale 15730" its only de the sandwich plate(have a friend y run that in is 2.0l ABA, and fit bolt ont ont stock treadpipe to oilflange) but i dont no ist it thermostatic or not..
3- "Derale 15752" thermostatic complete kit (with cooler, oil line, fiting, sandwichplate)
4- "Derale 25782" thermostatic complete kit (with cooler, oil line, fiting, sandwichplate)
i want to put the cooler outside the car, in front of the front bumper. what the best use kit? or any other company made external oil cooler, i look to buy one from old volvo, but i dont find one in good price
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whats the specs for each kit? the part numbers alone dont tell me anything.
especially enough info as to decide witch one is best for you..
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each kit, look the sam,but thermostatic is realy need? did you have any other compagny sell oen fit on diesel vw?
on derale website is not possible to copy spec and post her...after more check on website, each kit its thermostatic
each kit have adapter fiting to fit on filter flange vw.
but any engine oil cooler is good to fit on diesel engine? or need oen specific for diesel?
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i imagine they have different capacity coolers, and different thermostats in the sandwich plate..
if they were they SAME kit, they would have the same part number..
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the 3 complete kit, have a cooler size between 11x4x2
and 15730 its only the sandwichplate
all kit have 180f° thermostat in-case
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i buy 15730 from Derale at Canadiantire, from Keystone catalogue 41$
this is juste the sandwich plate, 3/4 centerhole and the oem tread tube its 3/4 to, so its bolt-on in oil filter flange. thermostatic 180f°, i wait for this for buy radiator cooler and hose
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i command 15730 from Derale at Canadiantire, from Keystone catalogue 41$
this is juste the sandwich plate 3/4 centerhole for the oem tread tube. thermostatic 180f°, i wath for this before buy oen cooler and hose
what?
i cant make any sense of that..
you mean you are just buying the sandwich adapter? no oil cooler its self? thats a great plan, how are you gonna cool the oil?
the OEM oil cooler is liquid cooled, and wont work with this sandwich adapter..
idk, maybe you were trying to say something COMPLETELY DIFFERENT..
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i dont put the derale with the oem coolant sandwich, y put only one derale in place, its fit bolt-on with the stock tread pipe/nut to the filter flange. so after install it, i check how much long hose need and size cooler fit properly in front bumper
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its gonna cost more than if you bought a pre-made kit..
usually the kits come with enough oil tubing to mount the cooler in front of the radiator just fine.. usually the feed and return hoses are 2-3 feet long each..
just use your imagination to determine how much oil hose you will need, you dont need one part of the kit to do it..
i would say that 6 feet of oil hose will make it possible to mount your cooler wherever you want to..
get one thats appropriately sized for a 1.6L engine.. call derale.. they will help you out. they know what they are selling, and what will work best for you..
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buy a lot of stock to built my setup. now i check for gauge, egt, oil pressure, and boost gauge...
but..for put boost gauge, in this setup.. i plug the hose for boost gauge directly on the elbow niple to top 1.6td intake manifold, the same place to the vaccum line is plug to the elbow to the lda pump stock?
i wait to for my derale sandwich plate. i post picture when to install in engine bay!
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any have sugestion?
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sounds like your on the right track..
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Update for new year!
After my last message here, I buy my first home and the jetta mk2 was parked for praticly all summer he run only 4000km in 2011.
So 1 month ago, I decided to start the making of new engine setup, after alot of work,renovation and rebuilt the old garage.
First the mk2 after he lastest washing in 2011 and go for the first time in is new home!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/tskm2/DSCF2666.jpg)
after 3 hour of fun
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/tskm2/DSCF2750.jpg)
2-3days after I buy some part. I make AAZ gasket mod, clean top block and botton head
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/tskm2/DSCF2754.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/tskm2/DSCF2756.jpg)
got pulley ?! it is ***ing hard to remove..broke.. I have 1engine 1.6D and 1 engine 1.6TD for parts in garage
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/tskm2/DSCF2749.jpg)
Put plastic bag on head and block, the cover on jetta, and clean all TD part I need for upper
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/tskm2/DSCF2695.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/tskm2/DSCF2744.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/tskm2/DSCF2743.jpg)
For now are stop here, I need new torque wrench for install all parts.
The battery tray need new metal and welding and I paint all the engine bay a special color!
Update again tomorow!
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the head are completly done, i start friday to clean the engine bay, buffer, cutting welding under battery train. paint tomorow
pic later of the update
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yesterday is time to start the engine! but not very good loll
the engine run rough, white smoke and only run on choke handle and little foot pressure on fuel pedal.
so today i check the timing belt again, rotate the pump on is axle back replace the belt,
now is start pretty good but little esitation white smoke again.
i dont have dial gauge for now to try to time properly the pump.
but you have a idea about that?
the 1.6D pump still in bloc a this time, im look to drive this pump this summer season for testing this D to TD engine
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There is a spot on the timing cover back plate to line up with the pump. It gets you close, or closer than just throwing the pump on.
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the spot where you put lock pin are you talk?
edit: the one on top edge of the braket need align with the line behind de bolt straigth forward to pump?
this is probably 1mm off in front of engine
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I think you have the idea. I am trying to find a pic to show you. Might want to search the FAQ. It is your friend here.
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(http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm307/J_holubek/Diesel/IMG00686-20110517-1634.jpg)
There is a spot right on the cover you can see in the pic that is indented out kind of like this < symbol. And a big line on the pump that is just to the left of the fuel line banjo bolt in this pic, but more toward the cover. They should line up somewhat to get you close...like this < -
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ok that i find couple minute, the little lub on metal plate straight line to the bolt its closer to the plate on bottom of the picture. i try this tomorow after job
thank more news tomorow! now on my engine that have a little 1-2mm off
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good new, the engine start very great but too adavance a bit of white smoke in exhaust
, i buy dialgauge adapter on ebay last week, so probably next one a receive them to make timing properly.
i start the engine but without alternator, because my alternator are dead the shaft didnt turn so i remove it for test the startup
and the oil ligth flash in the cluster.. is it normal if the engine run with no alternator?
im not sure but, look wierd, the high and low oil pressure sensor are new from last years and have never trouble last summer with oil pressure.
it the oil pump from 1.6D again into the block
the oil feedline are on top of the flange filter between pressure sensor, the oil come to the turbo, oil quantity are good..
i dont have oil pressure gauge or tester for test it for now
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advanced timing will make it start really good, and idle really well when cold. no smoke either. and it will be down on power..
if its smoking white, its probably got RETARDED timing..
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yeah timing ratarded, its my error lol
thaht not my biggest problem now, whem my dial adapter are here its easy to fix
but now its the problem with oil pressure..
idea?
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Alt light may not go out but the oil light I believe should act normally. They aren't hooked up to the incorrect spots are they?
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if the alternator isnt turning, then the oil pressure warning system cant operate correctly.
but you might want to verify, with a known good gauge, that your oil pressure is fine, or is in fact, an issue.
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There ^ you go. I guess get your alt working and you should soon see.
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It is good what of what I thought that if the alternator does not work the oil ligth flash
im waiting for my mk1 vdo gauge to check the pressure this week too
thank! more update and picture this week after my 15day back to back at work!
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in my jetta, all 3 lights flash continuously if the alt belt is gone, when the engine is running..
oil pressure lights dont bug me on my diesel. i know for a fact that i have 40psi oil pressure @ hot idle.
only time ive ever had an oil light come on, and i know i had no oil pressure, was the time my timing belt snapped.
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not on mine, at ON all ligth work. but when engine run, only the oil ligth came flash, but not buzzing..
but my alternator are remove from engine! its probably different because is 3 wires are not connected
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I can also confirm that the oil pressure light will flash if the alternator isn't connected / isn't turning. I fired up Jezzie with the V-belts off once and got a flashing oil pressure light as well as the alt light.
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im waiting the parts for my alternator now and i reseve my dial gauge adapter from ebay today, so this weekend i time the pump properly to is stock spec and take alot picture of is look rigth now!
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after 6month a find 2 used alternatoir and time to work on my old summer ride, yeah its the end of summer but a didnt have time this summer with my first home.
all front end are complet, engine run fine parked into the garage, but i have trouble with oil indicator.
when start the engine, indicator flash all time, and when the rpm go between 2000-2500rpm buzzer come in the cluster,
i try all the testing fron the bentley manual, but look like the 2pressure switch are bad or bad oil pressure/oil pump
i have no oil pressure gauge and buy one for 70$..
the engine have the stock 1.6d oil pump, is that make trouble?
i have 1.6td block with the pump, if it possible to swap complet pump or just the gear?
help me with that its the last piece of puzzle!
thank
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what the best? swap complet oil pump from td or just the gear?