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General Information => Troubleshooting => Topic started by: Smokey Eddy on March 28, 2010, 02:28:34 pm
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Firstly, no matter how hard i REEF on the alternator when i try to tighten it ALWAYS slacks off and the belt starts to slip and over the course of about 3 days my battery will die.
It has become SUCH a problem that if i don't charge my battery every night i can't drive my car. The pully spins fine, all my wiring and contacts and grounds are clean & fresh. The belt, when "tight" can still move about a 1/2 inch in the middle and when its running it wobbles like crazy which i know is too loose but i just can't for the life of me get it any tighter.
I need to make some sort of high tension sprung bracket for the alt but for now any suggestions on roughing up the pulley? it's polished to a mirror finish inside... I've changed the belt frequently to try and fix this never ending problem so the belt it's self is not smooth.
i tried using emery cloth but it didn't last for very long and same goes for jamming a file in there to rough it up.
I want to weld tacks on the inside of the pulley but i think that may be a bit extreme and murder the bearing inside the alternator.
My alternator has not been changed since i've owned the car so it must be at least 6 or maybe even 10 years old...
the battery is about 6 days old and is rated for 1026 cranking amps and 750 cold cranking amps. and "120 minutes reserve" what ever that means.
on a side note: after driving 35 minutes on the highway, i pulled into my block and it was a slight corner i guess? and the oil light + buzzer came on and buzzed for at least 20 seconds. the oil temp was 185F, the water was 90C...
I don't have the sensor on the head anymore i replaced it with a temp sender and i put it at the location of the other oil sensor (down by the filter) and just removed that one that was there entirely.
my understanding is that one of those reads low pressure and the other reads either temp or high pressure?
I understood that i kept the sensor that reads a drop in pressure in case i have some sort of catastrophic oil loss i'd have enough warning to shut off the car.
Some recent (as in the last couple days) issues are a huge leak from the feed line to the turbo and oil coming through the turbo.
So im wondering if there might be a blockage in the turbo somewhere?
Thanks for all input.
Running synthetic Moly Lubro 5w-40.
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my understanding is that one of those reads low pressure and the other reads either temp or high pressure?
It's pretty classic for cars with marginal oil pressure to start getting the buzzer after a run on the highway... oil is hot and very thin so pressure is low, particularly at low engine RPMs:
http://vincewaldon.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=40&Itemid=28 (http://vincewaldon.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=40&Itemid=28)
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after looking at your diagram there im thinking the issue may be my W terminal on the alternator. That clip piece on it is very loose, i don't think it connects very well anymore.
I dont have a tach so i would have never noticed it not functioning.
Your write up has also told me that i should not be using the low pressure switch with the high pressure wire... that could also be the issue.
thirdly, i think my filter is due for a change.
I had previously been changing the oil so frequently i hadn't changed the filter but its more than due for a change now...
So, Vince, my course of action is going to be to replace the filter and the connector on the W terminal and i'll see if i ever get a buzzer again.
If i do, i'll look into things in finer detail.
but my new oil leaks still are leading me to believe there is a flow issue somewhere - a blockage - which is REALLY worrying me.
(the sensor I'm using is the grey one 0.9 bar. I just changed the rod bearings. Perhaps the IM shaft bearing is the culprit.)
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Sand blasting the pulleys help with traction. I've had this sort of trouble, but less extreme, with all the A1 belt setups I've ever had.
I added the tensioning bolt from an A2 to the ac comp bracket, which is the most PITA one. You might consider a tighter belt, and make sure the width is correct. And counter intuitive though it is, don't tighten it any more than it absolutely has to be, or it WILL stretch, quickly. You can kill a new belt in a single day easy if it's too tight. It's not going to run smooth like a serpentine belt(or a well designed V belt since it isn't), not stretching it to heck seems to be important.
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check to make sure one of your pulleys isnt bent, or doesnt have a rock stuck in them. i know it sounds dumb, but just check. ive seen some pretty weird issues with VWs over time.
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The pulley has probably worn internally larger from belt slippage over the years. Replace it with a new one or look to a replacement belt of a slightly larger cross section. The OEM belt is a metric configuration. I think it is 10mm in width. It will be stamped on the outside back of the belt. The domestic belts are fractional inch measurement. Check different makes with a caliper set. You will find some slightly larger than OEM. These will be a fix for your situation albeit not a perfect one. Belt dressing or rosin will sometimes help too.
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The pulley has probably worn internally larger from belt slippage over the years. Replace it with a new one or look to a replacement belt of a slightly larger cross section. The OEM belt is a metric configuration. I think it is 10mm in width. It will be stamped on the outside back of the belt. The domestic belts are fractional inch measurement. Check different makes with a caliper set. You will find some slightly larger than OEM. These will be a fix for your situation albeit not a perfect one. Belt dressing or rosin will sometimes help too.
Ahh good idea!
The inside of the pulley is DEFINATELY not uniformed at all anymore. I'm 100% possative that it's all out of shape. I think i'll just get a new pulley of smaller diameter and a shorter belt.
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The pulley has probably worn internally larger from belt slippage over the years. Replace it with a new one or look to a replacement belt of a slightly larger cross section. The OEM belt is a metric configuration. I think it is 10mm in width. It will be stamped on the outside back of the belt. The domestic belts are fractional inch measurement. Check different makes with a caliper set. You will find some slightly larger than OEM. These will be a fix for your situation albeit not a perfect one. Belt dressing or rosin will sometimes help too.
Ahh good idea!
The inside of the pulley is DEFINATELY not uniformed at all anymore. I'm 100% possative that it's all out of shape. I think i'll just get a new pulley of smaller diameter and a shorter belt.
just remember that changing the size of the alt pulley from stock is going to make the tach misbehave. or anything that reads a W signal.
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just remember that changing the size of the alt pulley from stock is going to make the tach misbehave. or anything that reads a W signal.
Aw crap you're right... well I don't have a tach but the oil pressure thing would not be correct anymore. Hmph. I guess i'll get a new pulley of the same size then.Are you tightening both the bolt in the slot AND the pivot bolt?
You bet I am. And that huge 19mm one.
What im considering is drilling out the hole with the threads that is on the Alt and then get a much beefier bolt with locking nuts(or washers) and get a buddy to pull up on the alt while i tighten the bolts up. I'll use like a grade 8 bolt and nut and torque that stupid thing down & pray for the best...
What would be SWEET is if i made some sort of bolt on replacement bracket that was sprung so as the belt stretches it would remain tight. Also, im sure a few fellas on here who are SICK of the squeeling belt + dead battery issue with the mk2s would be interested if it was cost effective to produce.
Ideas? im sure some of you have already thought of this.
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Oh THATS what they call it is it?!
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But seriously yes, just like the serp set up except instead of having to buy all new pulleys and all that nonsense its just a replacement for that stupid bracket and should* fix** the issue.
*: the marked term is used very loosely in this context and in conjunction with the assumption that the author holds no responsibility for the ramifications of said actions.
**: the definition of the term queried may vary drastically from one person to the next.
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Perhaps you're missing the toothed nut that goes with the alternator adjustment bolt (#16A):
(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa85/vwaldon/Misc/altadjuster.jpg)
Makes it super-easy to tighten, and then you lock down the inner bolt and it stays tight.
P/N 034 903 555 B is evidently both the toothed nut and the inner bolt.
(http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa85/vwaldon/Misc/adjustor.jpg)
8 bucks at WorldImpex, so probably not too expensive even at the dealer. ;)
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There is also this thread I want to try before going to serp.
http://www.vwdieselparts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8173&highlight= (http://www.vwdieselparts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8173&highlight=)
I like Vince's thing there, but have only seen one once at a junkyard and when I went back to get it the car was gone. I don't think it had A/C either.
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you dont have to have a good gear on your alt bolt. you can keep it tight with just a normal bolt. i have a pretty power hungry stereo in my GTI, and i didnt have that gear on my alt for a long time. the only time my belt would squeal is when the alt would put too much pull on it. you are leaving something loose if your belt comes loose and squeals. does your car have a/c like a normal gasser a2? if it does, are you sure that you are tightening the belt that drives the a/c pump first, then tighten the alt belt after the a/c belt is tight.
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i do not have AC
when i try to tighten my alt. i get a friend to pull up on it and i tighten that 17mm bolt, the bolt that lets the bracket swivle and a third bolt that is where the geared bolt is supposed to be.
I too would like to add a tensioner if this issue still persists (which i likely will)
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i do not have AC
when i try to tighten my alt. i get a friend to pull up on it and i tighten that 17mm bolt, the bolt that lets the bracket swivle and a third bolt that is where the geared bolt is supposed to be.
I too would like to add a tensioner if this issue still persists (which i likely will)
why dont you just figure out why it does it and fix it? everyone else with V belts has no problem keeping them tight. the factory never put auto tensioners on them. take a loot at all your pullies, do they have the same width all the way around? sure one of them isnt squished a little bit? my audi has a whammied pulley, and depending on where it is in its rotation, it will either make the belt really tight, or really loose. its just kinda pinched, belt cant sink down all the way in the pulley.
might be something completely different tho.
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Yeah, i bought a much thicker belt and it seems to have helped. The issue is that it slowly over time with the vibrations seems to slacken off... like i should be using lock tite on the bolts or something??? I'm going to try some locking washers.
The car is starting to really need some work. Today on my way to the train station the brake pedal went rock hard scaring the **** out of me. Pardon my language but holy jeeze was that ever scary. it still stopped fine but i mean, when you feel the pedal go hard i always think the worst.
I desperately need to change the oil, filter, timing belt & tensioner, alternator pulley, and bleed the brakes (but i get home at 7:00 from work and everything is flipping closed and this past weekend was a holiday aughh the frustration). [i need to search about my brake pedal going so hard. It was like when you pump the brakes with no vaccuum (the car is off) and the pedal just goes hard... gave me the fright of my life because i live up a very large hill and i was at the time rushing to the train down said hill]
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my bet is either your vac pump took a dump, or your brake booster did. usually solid pedal is one of those 2 things. doubt bleeding the brakes will do anything. bleeding the brakes helps when you have a spongy pedal.
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Yeah i know air = spongy - bleed the air out.
What do you mean by "took a dump" because my braking came back afterwards...
it looks pretty old (the pump) and the booster looks excellent (like it has been replaced recently - no rust no corrosion)
i am going to bleed them because the pedal is normally spongier than i would like
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I had an issue with old vac lines from the pump to the booster with cracks in them giving me a hard pedal, until I spilled oil on them, then I got my brakes back!
I would start by checking the vac hoses and connections for leaks, sometimes the rubber hose will only leak under certain conditions giving you an inconsistently hard pedal
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hey yeah i seem to recall that rubber looks quite perished.
Is the pump it's self pretty fail safe? do they seem to last forever?
I was able to stop the car quite easily. I couldn't lock the tired up by any means but i could apply a decent amount of stopping force but i really had to try.
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if it is the rotary style then yes, they seem to last forever. the diaphragm ones not so much, but they are not hard or expensive to rebuild.
I would replace all the rubber vac lines(I did on mine, made a huge difference) and see what that does for you.
even with four wheel disc, my car stops just fine with no power assist, just takes more force.
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Yeah i wish i had 4 wheel disk. stupid drums...
Alright i'll find some good hose then! Cheers. Added to the list of "things to do on day off"
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Yeah i wish i had 4 wheel disk. stupid drums...
Don't sweat 'em too much... I know lots of folks that have taken all the time and effort to swap out the rear drums for disks... and not ONE of 'em is glad they did... a ton of work and no appreciable change in braking power. Kinda makes sense, since so little braking force comes from the rear.
In fact, VW rear calipers are known to be way more trouble when it comes to the emergency brake part of the mechanism.
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yeah, the only reason I have rear disc is because it came with them from the factory.
I like rear disc for a couple reasons, but I would not swap them unless the rear drums needed to be completely replaced anyway.
disc breaks dont work as well as drums without a booster, my point was that even a disc car stopped fine without boost, so a car with rear drums should stop fine without a booster too.
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The issue is that it slowly over time with the vibrations seems to slacken off... like i should be using lock tite on the bolts or something???
The geared tensioning nut not only makes it real easy to tighten the belt but locks the adjustment down super tight by binding against the teeth on the adjustment arm... no locktite or washers required. ;)
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Yeah i wish i had 4 wheel disk. stupid drums...
Don't sweat 'em too much... I know lots of folks that have taken all the time and effort to swap out the rear drums for disks... and not ONE of 'em is glad they did... a ton of work and no appreciable change in braking power. Kinda makes sense, since so little braking force comes from the rear.
In fact, VW rear calipers are known to be way more trouble when it comes to the emergency brake part of the mechanism.
Hey i've totally experienced this first hand... mk4 golf hand brake is constantly getting jammed.
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The issue is that it slowly over time with the vibrations seems to slacken off... like i should be using lock tite on the bolts or something???
The geared tensioning nut not only makes it real easy to tighten the belt but locks the adjustment down super tight by binding against the teeth on the adjustment arm... no locktite or washers required. ;)
I hear ya. I need to find me one. From sigh, the dealer. But before i can drive all the way out to the nearest vw dealer i need to order it likely. Maybe AVR can order it for me... bet they can. I'll call em up sometime.
cheers fellas
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and yes i still managed to stop the car just fine it was just scary because it's never a plesant feeling to have to grip the wheel and pull your self into the pedal to prevent your self from flying into heavy traffic at the bottom of the hill :P
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Yeah i wish i had 4 wheel disk. stupid drums...
Alright i'll find some good hose then! Cheers. Added to the list of "things to do on day off"
4 wheel disks stop you no faster than drums. i actually like the drums better because they dont lock up as easy. my GTI locks up all 4 tires very easily. its much harder to do a controlled stop when the rear breaks lock up too. i think i will stick with drum brakes unless the car comes with disks.
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rear disc will only lock up more easily than drums if they are improperly proportioned.
the proportioning valve plays a major role in how the braking system works.
unfortunately when most people swap to rear disc they forgo the proper proportioning valve(or even worse, leave in the drum residual pressure valve) and then get all upset when they perform like garbage.
that said, I have no plans to swap to disc on my new car, I just get a little bothered by all the people(especially on the vortex) who bash rear disc with no real reason(other than poor setup on their part)
now I know this is not a tread about brakes(sorry to eddy for cluttering his thread up) but what I was saying is that discs DO perform worse with no booster, and my car still stopped fine when I lost vacuum, so a car with rear drum should be even easier to stop(not worse)
I am done ranting, thank you for listening...
-Owen