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Engine Specific Info and Questions => TDI Engine -General Info => Topic started by: 92EcoDiesel Jetta on August 17, 2009, 07:47:04 am
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Anyone know what causes the cluster to go dead? Nothing works except the LED indicators when the key is turned on. Fuse is ok. I've read on the web somwhere that low voltage kills the B4 Passat clusters and is a common problem. I assume they mean a low voltage from the battery?
Can someone tell me how the cluster comes out? I tried prying gently here and there on the bezel that covers the cluster without getting very far and did not want to damage anything. I am looking for a Bently but would like to get the cluster out ASAP to see if I can fix it.
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Removal described here:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=255703
The cluster issue is described here on page 2 - the ELMOS chip and capacitor - can get one from another Motometer cluster and replace them.
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=237442
"That cluster has a poorly designed switching regulator chip with integrated stepper motor driver (TDI clusters all guages are stepper).
Regulator destroys itself when a support capacitor begins to fail.
As long as it is trying to power up with odometer and clock visible, the chip is still functional and we can save the cluster.
But you need to get it out of the car as soon as possible. I have seen cases where the chip has actually caught itself and circuit board on fire.
Chip is discontinued and no replacements are available, so need your chip in working condition to save the cluster. Chip is very stable when capacitor is good. We use only highest grade capacitor so you should never have any more problems.
Gauges in that particular cluster are beautifuly made swiss movements.
Sincerely,
Gavin"
Or go here for repair to have Gavin repair it:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280295089679&viewitem=
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You might find its easier to swap in a VR6 instrument cluster with some added benifits:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=101455
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Bumping an old thread....
My 96 Passat TDI's cluster has blanked out a few times since ownership. Got the car in August, and noticed it first happened when it dropped into the 40*s and the car sat for a few days.
The clock and milage blank out, but come back and look fine, although reset. Everything else operates normally. I did notice the tach needle hanging 250 RPMs higher than it should. Turned the car off and noticed it sat around 250RPM. The needle wasn't dropping all the way to 0. It ended up fixing itself.
I figure I better get this done before the cluster is toast.
Can anyone recommend a place or person to send the cluster to? In the US and without a long wait time would be ideal. Closer to NJ would be even better, lol.
-Todd
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Somebody on the Vortex fixed one for me, I can't remember his name but if you search thru some
threads with "passat cluster" you should be able to find him. They were ragging on him for not
being a vendor. I pmed him and he said about 200.00 to fix the cluster.
But when I sent it to him he said the only thing wrong was some blown bulbs,He also changed the
capacitor the goes out and returned shipped it for 13.00 total.
My problem ended up being a bad ground at the round cisc on top of the steering column.
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The grounds were something I wanted to check out this weekend.
I've seen the cylinder head and below the battery tray mentioned. This is the first mention of the steering column, that I've seen. Any other ground points that I should be aware of?
-Todd
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chubsauto(derek Dewhite) is the guy I trust to fix these clusters
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Good to know. Is chubsauto a screen name?
Anyhow, I spent a lot of time cleaning the grounds, brackets, etc, to ensure the best conductivity. I'll see if it does the trick. I didn't see a ground point as mentioned by the intake. The closest one was on a bracket that bolted to the water outlet flange on the rear of the head, by a main engine harness point. The ground stud would be to the right of the #4 injector if you were standing in front of the car, looking into the engine bay. Is this the correct one, or is there another in the vicinity?
The only ground that I didn't do was the one by the steering column. I'm guessing that it's under the plastic clam shell?
-Todd
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Thats the same guy Derek Dewhite, That did my cluster.
The grounds under the dash on my car were accesible thru the cluster hole
it is a round disc about 8 inches in diameter on top of the coloumn with about 20
ground wires bolted to it.
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I just got done pulling the cluster, and I don't think I needed to. There isn't any ground points on my column. I was surprised to see mainly white wires going to the cluster plugs....
There is a ground point on the A-pillar side, maybe a few inches above and to the left of the fusebox. It's a brown plastic disc roughly 4" in diameter. I pulled the d/s knee bar and have decent access. There are only 4 grounds used of a possible 20. I'll clean everything up tomorrow. It was getting too cold to be working outside.
Hopefully, this fixes the issue.
-Todd
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All the grounds are squeaky clean and greased, replaced the radio and reassembled everything. Car sat all day without being started (33*F outside) and I turned the key... cluster blanked out. F*CK!!
I'm going to send an IM to chubsauto, but in the meantime, is pulling fuse 21 to the cluster (before cold starting) a safeguard? It's inconvenient, but since this issue seems to be in the very early stage, I don't want to make it worse.
-Todd
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Spoke with Derek and I think I'll be paying for a MFA modded cluster. For the cost, it doesn't seem worth it to just change the caps, and hope the Elmo's chip is fine. I'll likely be shipping my cluster and possibly a donor to him, by the end of the week.
Question... reading the MFA tutorial, it mentions having a VR6 cluster as a donor. Does the donor need to be Passat specific? I don't think any of the necessary parts are Passat specific, but I'd rather be 100% sure.
-Todd
Btw, I asked him about pulling fuse 21, and he thinks it's a good idea. I guess it can't hurt.
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I pulled fuse 21, last night and the clock and odometer didn't go out. I'm guessing, it just holds the clock and trip memory.
Anyhow, I started the car (sat all day) and everything blanked out as expected, but this time is the first time that I heard a crazy buzzing sound. I'm guessing this is the stepper motor(s)? Shut the car off after a minute and restarted with the same result.
I pulled the cluster and shipped it out this morning. I guess this is the end of my dilemma.
-Todd