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Engine Specific Info and Questions => IDI Engine => Topic started by: Cody on January 06, 2009, 12:11:02 pm
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I have a 1991 TD Syncro Transporter and am wondering if anybody knows of anyway to replace the big air cleaner canister with something smaller.
I would like to clear up some room in the engine compartment to make room for an ESPAR coolant heater and an intercooler (down the road)
Cheers,
Cody
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cone filter
http://motors.shop.ebay.com/items/one-filter_W0QQ_trksidZm39
(http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e326/zu4sre54/3inchFilters1391.jpg)
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I'd be very careful about fitting a cone filter to a rear-engined car.
A cotton filter will let more particles through, and with a R/R car there are a lot of particles flying around! Maybe go to a breaker's yard and see which OEM filter box would suit you?
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100 % agreement with TurboJ. Most after market replacement and "performance" air filters go more harm than good, unless more induction noise and the look is more important than engine life.
If i were you why not install an air filter box above the transmission and connect it with a long tube. May not be good if you are going to do any water fording though. The other option would be to mount/shove the air box up into the d pillar above where it is now. Or how about on the other side with a corressponding tube to connect it.
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I was thinking you could possibly add a foot or two of pipe to the intake and route it elsewhere? that's what i was thinking with the cone filter.
I don't know rear mounted engines. Sorry!
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How about a K&N type of fiulter and is there a way of sticking it up the air passage in the rear panel where the snorkel is? It'd be sucking in the cleaner air from 6 eet up off the ground like the snorkel does now.
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Not all after market filters are cheap evil filters. Some are made to exceed OEM requirements. The K & N filter I'm using is one such. My filter alone was about $65. It is reusable, and is a "wet" filter so it does a better job of cleaning the air than paper OEM filters. It also has much more surface area so it is less restrictive.
(http://i533.photobucket.com/albums/ee338/the_arb/102_4499.jpg)
Here's a review http://www.autoanything.com/air-filters/60A2090A0A0.aspx
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Not all after market filters are cheap evil filters. Some are made to exceed OEM requirements. The K & N filter I'm using is one such. My filter alone was about $65. It is reusable, and is a "wet" filter so it does a better job of cleaning the air than paper OEM filters. It also has much more surface area so it is less restrictive.
(http://i533.photobucket.com/albums/ee338/the_arb/102_4499.jpg)
Here's a review http://www.autoanything.com/air-filters/60A2090A0A0.aspx
I'm sure a search will pull up some of the tests done on aftermarket air filters and in some cases the K&N's were the worse of the bunch. After reading a couple it gave my friend an OEM VW one to replace the K&N i had installed on the car i sold him. The test results were so bad it was scary. A few years ago i didn't understand why the INSIDE of my air filter housings of my 2.2 liter 71 beetle were dirty. I just thought that there was a leak where the surfaces met. I sod my webers for some bigger ones which came with smaller housings and filters, So far the inner parts of my housings are clean [and my carbs and motor].
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I'm up in arms about this as well. I have K&N filters on just about everything I own and they make a HUGE difference, but I only have about 50,000 miles on the longest one installed the rest are probably below 15,000 miles each. I ran them on my quad for years without ring damage. And every circle track car I worked on, but they usually got rebuilt everyother year anyway. But the one I got for my NA diesel rabbit didn't look as well built as the others. I don't know if I got a bad one or what. It was just the cotton didn't look as thick as my others.
All that being said I know the filtration system on the old John Deere B-type is the best of all. The oil bath system. K&N uses oil on the pleats which isn't quite as good as pulling air through a puddle of oil, but it should be better than a dry one. I think this is why my K&N filters are much dirtier every 3,000 than paper ones.
I will watch this as I still need to make a decision on the filter I will run. My feeling now is if I can get a "quality" one like in my older vehicles I will probably go with the K&N
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i'd trust these filters... but $$$$$$$$$$
http://www.amsoil.com/StoreFront/injen.aspx
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Air boxes are more over-rated than mufflers.
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I also have K&N filters on everything I own. I have never had a problem on any of them, we even have alot of gravel roads around here.
I did take the time to do a internet search about the evil K&N filters. All I could find was references to people that had done scientific tests, but strangely there was no link or indication on who did these tests. There is about as much scientific evidence on the search engine as there is here in this thread. If K&N was costing people engines they would have been out of business years ago.
In all my years of schooling and experience as a certified mechanic, the only people that have bad things to say about cotton filters are the ones that are either too lazy to do the maintenance on them or too cheap to buy one in the first place.
Just to add to my experience, I own a rear engined Fiero with a K&N filter that was used for a 2 way 250km trek to school for three years, and many more years of reliable driving. I also have one on a Polaris quad that does not have an easy life. Still no dirt injestion problems on either unit. I currently operate a Superflow SF901 engine dynomometer which primarily tests circle track engines in hobby, street, IMCA modified and sprint car engines. The engine builder that builds and maintains these engines uses mostly K&N. Still no dirt related problems turning up there. I do not know what else I can say here...
Sorry if this upsets people with opposing experiences or opinions.
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On my 86' Westy Weekender Syncro that I'm running a Turbo PG motor (Corrado motor sans G60 charger) I plumbed the K&N into the empty space forward of the driver side tail light assy. where it draws from the fresh air inlet, I then closed it in with a sheet metal panel so that it doesn't draw from the dirty air in the engine compartment. I have had absolutely no problems associated with it and have run it like this for about 15k miles.
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None of the out board engines I have ( 6hp - 90 hp) have any kind of filter - the idea being there's little dirt over the water. But, you _know_ there is some.
Our chrome-molley rings were developed for the air craft engines of WWII - also no air filters. They had a big problem prior to that of injesting sand on take-off.
My point is, I would not be too excited about using any type of filter that was designed to be wet (oil) as it has got to be better than nothing, especially if well maintained.
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None of the out board engines I have ( 6hp - 90 hp) have any kind of filter - the idea being there's little dirt over the water. But, you _know_ there is some.
Our chrome-molley rings were developed for the air craft engines of WWII - also no air filters. They had a big problem prior to that of injesting sand on take-off.
My point is, I would not be too excited about using any type of filter that was designed to be wet (oil) as it has got to be better than nothing, especially if well maintained.
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Do you have any pictures? On my diesel there is also the cooling air pump for teh turbo in that area as well as an extra plate of metal that we became aware of when putting in a Gary Lee Spare Tire Carrier. He hadn't seen it before on other vans and thought it might be because it is a European stock diesel. I'm not sure that I have the same amount of area as yourself in that section of the van. Also curious how much work there is in taking the plate apart and servicing the filter.
I suppose I could stick the K&N up teh passenger side Air shaft in behind the battery if it's small enough and then I'd have room on teh driver's side for the ESPAR and an intercooler??
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To clarify I thought I'd post some images:
Left side of engine bay where the Air Canister is taking up a lot of room:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3097/3202476553_21838a817c.jpg)
If the Canister is removed:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3081/3203325154_1da23562b3.jpg)
Also in the way on the Drivers side is the Air Pump for Turbo Cooling that is tucked in the Rear Air Intake Panel:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3340/3202473939_8fd3686ab6.jpg)
Looking at it from the Engine Bay:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3448/3203324890_b7b2b75360.jpg)
Right hand side with Battery in the way:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3535/3203325528_c763ca2c57.jpg)
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Why not take the whole canister and mount it above the transmission.connect it a long,more rugged hose.
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Okay looking at it again ,it is really big. Then why not move the turbo cooler over to the other side over the transmission and get a filter box and mount it where the pump is now??? The turbo cooler pump has to be already running a hose the left side i would imagine ? What is on the right side of the pump in the third picture ?
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You could move your battery to under the passenger seat as the gasser vans have?? Did I see a evil Fram filter too?? Mann only man!
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Right side of the pump in the third picture is a). the hose going to teh pipe which directs the air to teh turbo and b).above teh hose is the opening of the engine bay and you're looking at the brackets for the air canister.
Latest thinking is that the ESPAR D5 can go behind the battery. Still would move the air canister to allow for better routing of Intercooler hoses/piping.
Cheers,
Cody
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Went down to SynroSerge's place for a very enjoyable 4 day work session. Serge came up with what to me is the most elegant and functional solution to my needs. Given that I wanted to move/remove as little as possible but I wanted an I.C. and an ESPAR D5 installed in the engine bay with room for WVO heated filters, etc. and I wanted to keep the battery out of the back seat area, it was a tight squeeze but we did it.
First a comment about the most expensive part of the I.C.
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3608/3292262866_8030208acf.jpg)
More expensive than all else combined including shop supplies.
By The Way one of the Beautiful 90 degree 2.5" silicon hoses is for sale.
Sawing into the area at the bottom of the Cold Air Intake Flue:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3507/3292259154_ee4c499977_m.jpg)
The completed hole:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3182/3291442773_de45d417ab_m.jpg)
Note that the vertical fin of metal in the left side of the picture ended up going as well.
The I.C. sat in the space about like this:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3186/3291442961_863cd2c711_m.jpg)
Plumbed in the I.C. (Off of a Jetta TDI - Thanks TuneDub)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3357/3291443555_93d3bfe922_m.jpg)
Going from the I.C. to the Intake:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3336/3292260476_6ecf598aac_m.jpg)
Underneath it does clear the Catalytic Converter:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3609/3292261712_74ba74caef_m.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3450/3291444939_788161680a_m.jpg)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3536/3292261936_cf8c189ecf_m.jpg)
We had to take out the Turbo WasteGate Cooling fan. It wasn't working anyway and apparently some are of the opinion that it isn't really needed anyways (wasn't available on most applications). I'm hoping to ge it fixed and moved to the right side of teh engine bay with air supply from the right side cold air inlet flue.
We managed to put the stock air canister back in its place but getting its snorkel to fit in past the I.C. was tight:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3225/3291445665_e16be96aef_m.jpg)
There still needs to be some flashing put in place to help guide the airflow so that it goes through the I.C. from the cold air intake flue and not the engine bay and also passes through the I.C. and out the bottom.
Serge is trying to advise against my overengineering tendencies but nonetheless I'm going to figure out some way of getting the $20 motorcycle fan I got from TJ's Cycle (that was a cool looking atmosphere sort of place) to go on top of the I.C. Not much space though:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3542/3291443729_85cb02ef78_m.jpg)
Decided to stick the ESPAR D5 under the Battery location. It is within the orientation parameters of the installation guide although they probably thought the support bracket would be under the D5. Serge welded some angle brackets to the bottom of the battery shelf with the bolts for the ESPAR support bracket to attach to:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3511/3291443177_d765441ea4_m.jpg)
The D5 is then attached to the support bracket:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3464/3291443359_cbb76e7525_m.jpg)
The D5 is held to the support bracket by hook shapes in the bracket and through body screw. I'm going to use strappping to help hold it in place until I come up with a better solution.
I would've preferrred to have the I.C. laying flat-normal to the air flux but it wouldn't fit with the 1 I.C. hose connection that was at an angle. Perhaps you could take the 1 straight side off of 2 separate I.C.'s and make 1 I.C. that has 2 straight connections but as well I think there would have been issues getting the Air Canister to fit with 2 hoses coming out of the I.C. instead of just the 1 I have.
Cheers for comments,
Cody
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When the time come for the air cleaner decisions on a couple of projects I have going, I think I'll go see the guys at Vortox http://www.vortox.com/index.html
They've been doing large & small air cleaners forever and are very specific about what works with what airflow requirements, established by very serious R & D lab testing. Their industrial design & quality is probably not cheap, but neither are new ngines.
Looks like they have a wide range of dry paper filters, as well as their oil bath units that really flow well, but are very low in maintenance costs. I'm cheap, even when I'm spending a bunch, so I just might go with one of their oil bath units, to save money in the long run.