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General Information => General => Topic started by: jimfoo on June 08, 2008, 01:57:12 pm
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Driving up a trail today when the engine starts running away. I finally get it stopped and redo the plumbing to bypass the turbo, which is full of oil. Get it started again and it's running, but when I give it some gas, getting the revs up around 3k, it will start backfiring out the exhaust. So I get it turned around, kill the engine and slowly coast back down the trail. get to the road, start it again and slowly try driving to where there is a phone. I only get half way there when I no longer have much power to the wheels. I turn the engine off and after a while I figure out that I must have sheared all the flywheel bolts as the starter no longer turns the engine over, but will move the car. I'm getting tired of all this crap happening!!! :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:
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what if the clutch was just soaked in oil? could it possibly slip enough to not turn the engine over???
damn that is some bad luck man :( do you think its the turbo?
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No, the starter will move the car, so the clutch must be good, but the engine just sits there while cranking. I'm hoping for maybe just some bent valves, but with my luck.... Then again, I'm lucky the bolts didn't break when I dumped the clutch in gear to kill the engine, otherwise I'd have loads of engine pieces. It was scary how fast it was turning. Has to be the turbo as I could see loads of oil in it, and didn't have any blowby when I took the oil cap off.
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when you gets things apart , i'd take a good look at the oil return tube from the turbo , making sure it's not even slightly restricted .
my heart goes out to you , i think most of us have been in similar situations where the work and bills keeps piling up from things breaking that shouldn't be breaking .
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No, the starter will move the car, so the clutch must be good, but the engine just sits there while cranking. I'm hoping for maybe just some bent valves, but with my luck.... Then again, I'm lucky the bolts didn't break when I dumped the clutch in gear to kill the engine, otherwise I'd have loads of engine pieces. It was scary how fast it was turning. Has to be the turbo as I could see loads of oil in it, and didn't have any blowby when I took the oil cap off.
if you pull the head be sure to take some pics... i'd like to see how those Prothe pistons took the abuse :o
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Because at the RPM's it was running at, I can't help but think the valves were floating.
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I think that even in a runaway injector pump, the governor in the pump should have prevented engine damage.
Ya if it was a IP runaway I agree. I wonder though....
That really sucks jimfoo, my engine just ate a turbo as well, filled the IC with oil on its way out.
Out of the 5 qts that was suppose to be in the oil pan over 4 were in the IC.
Less than a qt in the pan. I was VERY lucky I was in front of my house and had it in 3rd already so I could dump the clutch, I can only imagine what would have happened if my wife would have been driving.. I would be building another engine..
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Appreciate the valve offer. You know, this run away engine thing has me really glad I don't have an automatic. How would you stop the thing then? The way it sounded, there would be no way in hell I'd get out, open up the hood and block the intake. I'm actually going to work on some type of valve to block the air flow once I get everything else repaired. Also maybe some type of trap in the pipe to help hold oil, or at the very least, allow me to see if it's blowing oil so I can prevent it. Actually I was also thinking about putting a small diameter hose off the drain on the IC and running it back to the oil pan or valve cover.
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Actually I was also thinking about putting a small diameter hose off the drain on the IC and running it back to the oil pan or valve cover.
I was considering installing a drain in my IC just for giggles. Just a regular petcock off a radiator would be easy to install. would be nice to have a bung installed to thread it into so the petcock wasn't above the lowest part of the IC if that make any sense at all..
I also considered installing a small nipple like 1/4" and just hanging a short piece of hose off it with a plug in the end so the plug could be removed for draining then reinstalled..
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[quote="jimfoo I'm actually going to work on some type of valve to block the air flow .[/quote]
Correct me if I'm wrong but don't TDIs already have this feature on them?
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Yes they do. It's called an anti-shudder valve or intake flap valve.
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Like a electric dump valve for an exhaust system, with the function reversed. Open would be normal, closed would be for run away.
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i wonder if a large throtel body on the intake of the turbo , like off of a 5 litre mustang for example , would be strong enough to stop a runaway vw ?
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i wonder if a large throtel body on the intake of the turbo , like off of a 5 litre mustang for example , would be strong enough to stop a runaway vw ?
probably... the starvation of air would create quite a bit of vacuum though... would need to catch it right away before the airflow gets too high :lol:
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I'd put it right before the intake myself.
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I'd put it right before the intake myself.
my PD engine (2006) has an electric actuator for the EGR system.. since i'm gutting that crap out maybe i can donate it to someone's cause? i dont think it closes all the way, but could easily be adapted to do so (at least i think :lol:)
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I'll try it...
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I'll try it...
ok i'll ship it to you when its off. which might not be in the near future... :cry:
if adapted correctly you could use it in a supercharger system or a compound turbo setup :twisted: although earlier versions might be easier to control on a non electronic engine, as they are vacuum powered.
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If I can't figure how to control it electrically, I'm sure I could modify it to work off a cable. Better late than never. :lol:
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I will also probably pull the pump apart to look in it. What kind of damage, if any, might I be looking for from running it way over speed?
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First pics from tranny removal.
(http://www.66rover.com/runaway/sclutch.JPG)
The 6 sheared bolts and broken clutch disc and pieces.
(http://www.66rover.com/runaway/scrank.JPG)
The rest of the bolts in the crank. I sure hope they come out ok.
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:shock: looks like it's salvagable! damn that thing must have been screaming !!!!!
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So you stopped then engine by dumping the clutch in gear? Good thing the engine died after the flywheel bolts sheared off. I think you should pull the cam plate out of the pump and measure the lift to see if it got worn down and maybe the cam rollers too.
I guess it's good to know the weakest part of you engine is the flywheel bolts! :lol:
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Actually they sheared after the engine stopped, I reeouted the air hose and I started driving again. I had to buy bolts as the VW ones were too short for the Toyota flywheel. I had 8.8 in it, but will be replacing with 10.9.
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Actually they sheared after the engine stopped, I reeouted the air hose and I started driving again. I had to buy bolts as the VW ones were too short for the Toyota flywheel. I had 8.8 in it, but will be replacing with 10.9.
Ah-ha. I was going to say, I've never seen that happen in a VW before. :P I'd probably try and find some ARP bolts that are the right size if it were me.
At least nothing majorly catastrophic happened!
Brendan
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Someone brought up a point that I hadn't thought of before. I had problems with my idle slowly increasing over time. It would idle fine when first started, but would then increase after a minute or so. It may have been due to some oil getting sucked through, kind of an unheeded warning before the final catastrophe.
Got the broken bolts out very easily with a left hand drill bit, and luckily the crank seems fine. Now to get $ for the turbo rebuild and new pressure plate and clutch disc and whatever else.(hopefully nothing...)
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I never saw those bolts broken like that. Maybe you should get some nice heavy duty bolts for that. It looks like they couldn't just hold the torque and passed out due to stress.
I'm glad it wasn't that serious at last. Just a bit of extra work and it's on the road?dirt? again. :)
Jim, btw, I'm working on your disk upgrade thing, finally had to go to a mechanic friend of mine and we'll be comming with news soon. He said there's a parts dealer here that may provide the solution.
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Thanks, that would be really sweet!!