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General Information => Upgrades (non engine related ) => Topic started by: mtnbob on December 08, 2007, 09:48:56 pm
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I'm replacing my pads with ceramic on the front and was wondering if there are any reasonable upgrades for my rear drums?? can they be switched to disc? is it worthwhile? I'm spoiled from the ceramic pads i put on my outback so i thought i'd try the same on my daily driver 8)
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Yes, You can disc the back. My 89 Jetta came factory with rear discs it has the Carat Package.
You'll need to find a an 85-92 Golf GTi / GTi-16V or an 85-92 Jetta GLI / GLI-16V or 88-89 Jetta Carat. I think 87-88 Scirocco 16V will work, brake cable is different though I think. Take everything from the stub axle out to the bearing cap. Actually, if you find a car with a complete rear disk setup, take the whole thing, then you get a sway bar too.
You might need to add a proportioning valve so grab that if there is one. My 89 has standard 9" brakes and rear discs with no prop valve but, I think the car with 10.1 brakes did.
You can also check the Golf II & Jetta II Parts Classifieds over on the Vortex or ebay, they show up fairly often.
I'd say it's worth it... If only the reason I hate doing drum brakes. :D
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Cool great info!!!! 8)
And a woot!!! for Englewood I used to work over there as part of my territory in F.L. I lived near Orlando for 24 years.
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Hah.... Someone that knows about Englewood.... Who would have thought.
I may be heading North soon....
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I was tired of f.l. after 25 years. I like it here in upstate s.c., still not to far from the ocean and I can see the mountains everyday 8) and some snow but not too much unless i venture north a bit.
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good pads an rotors and a set of fresh wheel cylinders with new shoes makes a drastic difference in braking performance.
if you do choose to go rear disc, make sure to run the prop valve, it becomes a major safety issue to run without it
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good pads an rotors and a set of fresh wheel cylinders with new shoes makes a drastic difference in braking performance.
if you do choose to go rear disc, make sure to run the prop valve, it becomes a major safety issue to run without it
you mean with the proper proportioning valve? will the one for the drum brakes work?
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what i mean is, if you swap to discs, you also need to run the rear beam mounted stock proportioning valve. the cars that came with drums may or may not have it. the screw in pressure valve on the MC are not enough to illeviate 100% of the rear lock up, if you get in a low grip situation or have a very light car, the rears WILL lock up without proper proportioning
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If you're planning the rear disc conversion, you may need to consider a larger master cyl. to send more juice to the rear. The MK II stock 8v came with a 20mm master (IIRC), and the 16v (with rear discs) came with a 22mm (again, IIRC).
Good luck
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a larger master is not necessary. adding a larger one simply changes the amount of pedal effort required to press the pedal down. this is a common mis-conception.
i run 9.4's w/ rear discs with the 20mm master, it works great.
going with huge front brakes may require a larger master, but changing the rears does not. if you think about it, you have to decrease the pressue substantially to keep the rears discs from locking, why would you need even more going to them?
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i have a 88 1.6gtd that has the 20mm MC and drums in the back.
it has proportional valve.
long story short:the car brakes bad.
i have to make much force to the brake to get it stoping but it doesent slowdown that much...and if i go all the way on the pedal the wheels will lock.
what can i do to improve this?
i have changed the stock discs with 239mm vented ones with new pads but still no luck...
dont know how are the drums but according to what i have read the front do almost all the work rigt?
if i upgrade to 22mm MC with gti brake booster what would be the difference?and what about goung to late models larger drums?
any help will be appreciated as i have a golf g60 and compared to that the gtd has no brakes... :roll:
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well i'll try and help but will be hard because i'm not there to look at the car!
is your vacume pump working? and old brake components usually don't work as well as new! new brake parts may help? your proportioning valve working properly? they do go bad! mine on my rabbit is bad where i only have the front brakes working till yesterday a line blew!!
but i woul check your vacume pump first that sounds like your problem with the reason why you have a hard pedal?
thanks Duane
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the pedal is not that hard...the thing is that it takes some force to get the car braking...
how can i check if V.pump is ***?
also,could be the pads contaminated?
3 months ago a oil line that goes to air/oil cooler leakead and it went to the wheel(i know because i hit the brakes and only one side did brake...).
i never thought about it because the car was ok after that(well,i never used the brakes that hard in the time...) :roll:
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the pedal is not that hard...the thing is that it takes some force to get the car braking...
how can i check if V.pump is ***?
also,could be the pads contaminated?
3 months ago a oil line that goes to air/oil cooler leakead and it went to the wheel(i know because i hit the brakes and only one side did brake...).
i never thought about it because the car was ok after that(well,i never used the brakes that hard in the time...) :roll:
the hose that goes to power booster you take off and feel some suction while the motor running! yes oil,grease, brake fluid will contaminate the pads! and make it hard for brake pads to grab! remove pads and spray a brake cleaner! but do not spray on yor caliper! the solvent in that will expant any rubber componits! use a dish washing soap when near rubber parts! A lot of people make the mistake and spray everything with a can of brake parts cleaner! and it will ruin any rubber parts unless it otherwise states on the back of can!
plus when brakes get old they don't work as well as new! rust and road dust and debree help them not move back and forth as well!
well try that?
thanks Duane
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do i spray brake cleaner on the pads now?
they have run 5/7.000km since the oil issue...
i suposed that now they have been used enough to clear any oil that were in the surface?
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do i spray brake cleaner on the pads now?
they have run 5/7.000km since the oil issue...
i suposed that now they have been used enough to clear any oil that were in the surface?
i think the pads can soak up the oil... if you caught it early you could just burn it off by driving the crap out of it.
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i guess that my best bet is to check for the rear drums and the proportional valve adjustment.
will check the pads too.
then i will look for a 22mm Master cilinder and brake booster...
its ok to use that without rear discs?
they are plug and play or do i need to replace anything to make them work?
that way if i´m not happy i wont be taking more parts out to garbage as i would need them as well when upgrading to bigger discs/calipers right?
can someone tell if the brake booster on 20mm setups is the same size as in 22mm?
its easyer to fing a MKIII or passat than a MKII gti,if its 4x100 it will work?
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Also the type of pad can make a huge difference. The best I've found so far is the Hawk HPS pads. They will make a noticeable difference. When putting new pads on, skuff the rotors with about 100 grit emery paper and clean with brake cleaner. Google" Bedding In Brakes" = good info. Make sure all contact surfaces, caliper sliders, where the pads touch the slider are smooth.
Good Luck!
-JB
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My 2 cents about great brakes. I live on a 5 mile hill that represents an autocross course. Here it is...
Running front vented rotor is important in my situation, my rabbit runs 90 cabrio pads and rotors. Pads are the same, but half thickness. Mt jetta runs the large 88 gli pads and rotors and spindle/caliper bracket. But the cabrio is direct replacement (with vents).
Rear - I had gli pads and rotors ebrake on my last jetta and always had problems. either the slides froze, ebrakes hung up, rotors delamed...
I run Drums on back. Properly adjusted they rock. Really I hammer this thing and never smoke brakes any more. The trick is to back off e-brake cables remove one lug nut, stick pick thru lug nut hole, into the hole on the brake adjust self adjust trangle where the small spring is hooked. Now by turning the drum backwards it will pull it down and bring proper preload to shoes. Let the drag just a little. Now adjust e-brake
If you still require more rear braking, For those who like to get it to slide out, remove weight proportion valve under rear pass. seat. Hope this helps.
The brake adjust trick is cool. No need to remove tire. Use for unadjusting to remove drums with ridge. Grind of ridge! It saves time later.
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great suggestion, i'll try it!!!
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FWIW, from my BleachedBora Bargain Bin on TDIclub:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=152185
*A3/A2:
-Front brake upgrade kit (stock size is 256mm)--includes 288mm drilled and slotted rotors, calipers, and pads --- $475/set shipped
-Complete rear disc brake conversion (w/calipers, bearings, stub axles, proportioning valve (1H0 612 151C), parking brake cable x2 (1H0 609 721E), cross drilled or solid rotors & pads) --- $625/set shipped
-Rear disc brake conversion without cables or proportioning valve --- $475/set shipped
I have had a lot of A2/A3 drivers go with the conversion kits and they have loved them. Just another option for those that want to go new... :)
Cheers,
-BB
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There is only one brake pressure regulator (load sensitive) listed by VW for the mk2 Golf (A2 to you yanks) ATE 357 612 151 for either disc or drum brake models
I changed to disc brakes as soon as I bought my GTD, next I plan to fit Audi 80 S2 Girling 60 two pots, golf g60 discs and a bigger servo and master cyl