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General Information => FAQ/Tech Tips/Please Read First => Topic started by: burn_your_money on July 11, 2007, 07:17:03 pm
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This is a painfully easy swap. It appears that the bracket is the same for AC/non AC. All of these parts are from a 95 AAZ (1.9TD)
You may run into problems clearing the frame rails. I have not installed the engine into a car yet so I don't know.
Mk1 guys are going to need to take a grinder to the IP/PS mount bracket
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck075.jpg)
Install 4 of the 5 bolts. These are serp specific
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck077.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck084.jpg)
This is the missing bolt, probably not too big of a deal.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck078.jpg)
The bracket will slide right on. Notice I've swapped on a mk2 IP bracket for the pictures
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck079.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck080.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck081.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck082.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck083.jpg)
You can see the PS pump is still driven by a v-belt. All the needed adjusters are on the PS pump.
Here is the other style where the WP is also driven by a v-belt
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/burnyourmoney/truck069.jpg)
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i dunno about you guys... but that setup looks identical to an aba serp setup...
when i get my block back from the machine shop i'll have to try and bolt up my aba setup from my 1.8t thats waiting to go in my mkII (yes i have an aba setup on an older aeb 1.8t) the 1.8t isnt ready to go in yet, still need an intake manifold custom made for me, and an oil return line...
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Good idea making a tech tip thread.
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It would be great to see some pictures of an ABA setup as well. I'm not sure about the ABA but there might be problems with it clearing the timing belt, they are usually wider on diesels
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I have the ABA setup at home, I'd be very interested if it fit!
Thanks for the great writeup.
Garry
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I have an aba setup I can snap a photo of.. Tyler, can you get a part number off your big alumnium bracket?
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It would be great to see some pictures of an ABA setup as well. I'm not sure about the ABA but there might be problems with it clearing the timing belt, they are usually wider on diesels
im *pretty* sure the aba tensioner is flexible.... i.e you can pull it out that arm just a bit if i remember correctly
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the bracket is a different part number ...
AAZ part # for the 1.9 setup is 028903139t
ABA part # is ....
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bracket # from a 94 aba is #037 903 143E
I'll try to fit this one tomorrow
(http://smellslikefries.com/vwpics/abaserp/abaserp1.jpg)
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ABA bracket doesn't fit.
the tensioner part hits the IP , so I don't think you can hack it up to make it fit. If anyone sees a way to make it fit, i'd gladly eat some crow
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Thanks for the update, I'm sure you saved a bunch of people some hours at the junkyard
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is that PS pump from the 1.9? can a 1.6 PS pump bolt up? do the 1.6 lines bolt up to the 1.9 pump if it is required?
just trying to track down some odds and ends for getting my 1Z motor back together!
thanks! nice pics! if i was staying with a 1.6, i would definitely want to go the serp route for the alt... the v belt keeps slipping. it was on too tight before, and the pulley flew off while driving :shock:
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With the serp setup you need the 1.9 pump (or possibly an ABA one). You can not bolt up the 1.6 pump to the 1.9 brackets. You can use the lines and bolts from the 1.6 on the 1.9 pump. One is a bit too long but an extra washer in there works well
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Not to forget to replace the cranshaft pulley bolt by a new style installed on the 1.9TD.
The problem on the 1.9TD cranshaft wobble is caused by the serp set-up, and worsened if there is no ratchet pulley on the alternator.
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Why would anyone want serp belts on a 1.6?????? Your going the wrong direction here making things more expensive and less reliable! The tensioners always fail on the serp belt set up, the bushings wear out, they stress the crank noise and lead to massive failures if the above parts are not maintained, the mk3 p/s pump will not fit a 1.6 cause the rear bracket has wider bolt spacing which does not exist on the 1.6 block (already found that one out installing a 1.6 into 96 Jetta)
A vbelt costs $5 and last years...
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other numbers for the serpentine bracket from AAZ
028 903 143AB
028 903 139J
028 903 139T
I tried the ABA crank pulley / harmonic balancer but doesn't work with this bracket
you have to get the one from the AAZ
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what is the part number for the bracket and water pump pulley??
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water pump pulley for serp belt is from an obd1 vr6
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Way to step it up a notch :D
What you are saying about the 4th bolt does make sense. I guess time will tell
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if you guys give me some time
I will be doing a complete write up using every bracket out there INCLUDING the AFN unit.
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Cool beans. Gotta like complete write-ups in the FAQ section!
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Why would anyone want serp belts on a 1.6?????? Your going the wrong direction here making things more expensive and less reliable! The tensioners always fail on the serp belt set up, the bushings wear out, they stress the crank noise and lead to massive failures if the above parts are not maintained, the mk3 p/s pump will not fit a 1.6 cause the rear bracket has wider bolt spacing which does not exist on the 1.6 block (already found that one out installing a 1.6 into 96 Jetta)
A vbelt costs $5 and last years...
phffff...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v727/pointyourgun2/DSCN4194.jpg)
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Ashley, if I'm not mistaken, you have the AFN setup with the spring under the alt, correct? Is the AFN bracket held on by the same four points with the boss for the bolt by the injection missing on the 1.6? Did you compensate for the missing bolt in any way?
ABF set up <3
i think you asked about that before. i didn't use the fourth bolt.
picture of bracket with alternator removed.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v727/pointyourgun2/DSCN4143.jpg)
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no problem.
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Are the ABF and AFN setups Euro things that I'd have to hunt for and order up?
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Are the ABF and AFN setups Euro things that I'd have to hunt for and order up?
you can order the ABF or piece it together yourself.
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if you guys give me some time
I will be doing a complete write up using every bracket out there INCLUDING the AFN unit.
Issam, you rock.
I'm very interested in this as well. The v-belt setup when you have AC and PS is sketchy at best. My main concern, since this Golf belongs to my Wife, is if she looses one of three V-belts while driving down the road, she's basically screwed. She is fairly mechanically competent, but I doubt she would be able to replace a V-belt with the current setup on the side of the road. I don't think I would even attempt it. A serp belt, on the other hand, would be a hell of a lot easier. I had to pull the PS pump after it was all together, and I could not get the adjustment on the PS pump to loosen enough to remove the belt, I had to unbolt the pulley from the hub to get it off.
It would be nice if there was another way besides the unobtainum AAZ stuff for us in the 'States.
Brendan
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sweet avatar allusion.
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Did some mock-up for my 1,9 build. Serp setup is from AEF, crank pulley from AFN. AEF crank pulley is ~inch larger, wanted to use a little smaller one.
(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/mattif/80q/th_P3220363.jpg) (http://s13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/mattif/80q/?action=view¤t=P3220363.jpg)
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Nope, itīs stock setup. Pump is different.
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Like I said, it's stock AEF setup. Water pump housing is same casting than alternator and ps pump brackets. Water pump is same than longitudal TDI. Actually, pump housing casting is same.
On negative side, 2 bolts are located different and earlier blocks doesn't have those. AEF is 1,9 na from Polo, Caddy, Skoda Felicia etc, mid to late 90s. TDIs from Audi A4/A6 and Passat 3B.
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If factory installed it like that, maybe it is designed to spin counter-clockwise. ::) Pump 028121004 and housing 028903141AP (http://skodaalkatresz.unas.hu/shop_ordered/1459/shop_pic/028903141AP.jpg)
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Sorry for taking so long, have been fighting with my dailydriver ::) But now back to 1,9 project.
(http://www.kotinet.com/matti.farm/Audi/21042010013.jpg)
Pump housing bolts to red circles. Blue is what usually is the second upper bolt, in this case it's pilot bushing hole. Picture is from AEF block, Audi A4 TDI is same kind.
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Too dumb to search and actually find something. I need to know how to aquire the pieces for the abf or afn setup. I need that write up that was posted about long ago. I want A/C, so let me know guys how to do this.
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Really. Those should be easier to find. I will start looking. That writeup still would be nice from last page.
Found the crank pulley fairly reasonable on autohaus. Is the dealer the only place in US that you can get the bracket and water pump pulley?
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I think you can also use a VR6 water pump pulley, should be the same.
Brendan
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I've heard that the VR6 one is the same, and my brother had it on his AAZ (non AC) but I sold the pulley to a local and he said it didn't work and returned it. He said it hit something. He went to the dealer and bought the AAZ pulley and it fit. I'm still confused on how that worked.
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no power steering.
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So import 2 pumps from finland. One to use and one for spare. Then the aaz brackets and water pump pulleys? Sounds like fun.
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I can deal with one V-belt instead of like, 90.
The Mk3 ABA's had a serp + v-belt too, but I thought the V-belt ran the power steering on those. Don't remember now.
Brendan
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i am a little confused.
i'm running a car with no power steering, but it currently has a/c.
i'm fine with ditching the a/c, but i don't want to make things extremely difficult for myself.
i've read through the thread a few times now, but i'm not sure which route to take for the serp setup.
should i be looking for an aaz bracket setup, including the alternator?
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It sounds like what you want is exactly what ashleyroe has. Check her posts again and you should have your answers.
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If factory installed it like that, maybe it is designed to spin counter-clockwise. ::) Pump 028121004 and housing 028903141AP (http://skodaalkatresz.unas.hu/shop_ordered/1459/shop_pic/028903141AP.jpg)
Do you know the part number for the double sided serpentine belt for this setup? I am able to locate both of these part numbers in ETKA and get a price of $70.50 for the pump and $109.50 for the housing. Do you know if the pump housing will mate up to the 1.6L TD block?
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I have performed the serpentine swap on my 1987 golf and am very satisfied. No more shredded veebelts lol
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Will the serp bracket from the 1Z / AHU work for this mod?
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yes
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I have performed the serpentine swap on my 1987 golf and am very satisfied. No more shredded veebelts lol
Which configuration? With or without Power Steering and/or Air Conditioning?
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No Ac No power Steering No more problems ;)
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Yep. Mine has been totally trouble free since install.
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Just remember to perform some maintenance on the bracket if you find one off a car with unknown miles or you will forever have a terrible squeek on cold days. This is the tensioner arm physically rubbing through the pressed in bushings. Supposedly what will eventually happen is it will eat all the way through the bushing and eventually crack the bracket. For peace of mind I replaced the tensioner arm , bushings, spring, seals and regreased with some nice thick CV joint grease.
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So after some long term use of the serpentine setup I would advise against it unless you weld a tab to your injection pump bracket to bolt the 4th bolt of the bracket. I had my bracket crack and had to scramble to find a v-belt setup as the serp bracket is not available from vw anymore