VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.
Engine Specific Info and Questions => Diesel Swaps => Topic started by: bbob203 on October 21, 2012, 09:04:27 am
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I have been planning this project for awhile now and I'm finally starting to get the parts together. This will be my place to post my progress ask questions and display picturres I may snap along the way. My goal for this car is a long haul car for doing cross country driving loaded up with a top cap for cargo and the back end setup with a mattress for sleeping.
Here's a list of what a plan on putting in the car..
1z motor out of 96 passat with libbydiesel mtdi pump
02a ctn tdi trans $550 3.15 r&p. .75 but I plan on using a. 68 if I can get one.
might go with a corado clutch
(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b75/bendover817/2012-11-27090650.jpg)
Here are some pics of the motor 230,xxx well maintained southern motor $1000
(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b75/bendover817/IMG_3903_2.jpg)
(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b75/bendover817/IMG_3902_1.jpg)
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Question: passats are already hydro clutch right?
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Question: passats are already hydro clutch right?
they are but I'm buying the car empty with no engine or transmission parts. cable clutch more reliable to me.
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You know what to get for the cable conversion? I have all the parts and can give you the PN's. Also, the cable is NLA, so use a 1991 CRX cable; I know it's long but you can loop it around the engine bay a bit.
EDIT: The cable was advised for putting an 02A into a MK1, but it might still work which is why I suggested it.
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You know what to get for the cable conversion? I have all the parts and can give you the PN's. Also, the cable is NLA, so use a 1991 CRX cable; I know it's long but you can loop it around the engine bay a bit.
EDIT: The cable was advised for putting an 02A into a MK1, but it might still work which is why I suggested it.
I was gonna get this kit
http://euro-wise.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=336
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It might be an idea to block off the EGR pipe now. Even with the engine being low miles you could pull the inlet manifold and check for crud build up in the ports. It's far easier to clean out any build up with the engine on the floor than it is when the engine is in the bay.
The 02A cable clutch conversion parts will be more expensive than finding a decent slave cylinder and pipework. The hydro clutch setups are really not that unreliable. Is the pedal box still fitted to the car with clutch master cylinder?
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I guess I would have to swap out the pedal cluster to. but I think dude is taking all clutch stuff with trans.
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It might be an idea to block off the EGR pipe now.
Definitely going to do that.
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if he no take pedals.. keep hydro... the lines between master and slave is 6mm brake line.. can build your own if you had too.. a 6mm flex line, 2 pieces of preflared steel lines.. bolt together.. done... how i extended my hydro line stuff in the kubvan...
glad on 02a...
think of intercooler where at... tons of room under hood.. but front air.. not so much...
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What about ac lines? will they need to be custom?
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16v lines no fit tdi compressor... so yea custom unless you want v belts, then mk1/mk2 diesel w ac fits the stock ac lines..
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16v lines no fit tdi compressor... so yea custom unless you want v belts, then mk1/mk2 diesel w ac fits the stock ac lines..
That might be a project for a later date. A/c isn't super important but not way id voluntarily go back to belts to have it.
Im dead set on doing the tdi i have a 600 deposit on the motor picking it up monday.
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What do about tank sending unit. Have read ideas before but cant find anymore? Take out guts in gas one?
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cause u asked on poortex... :P
guts modded or passat tdi wagon, 96-97 supposedly fits...
u need to see what vr6 ac lines like... may be able to retro fit them in.. but 1st figure out if comps/fittings same ;)
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Could i put the ac clutch pulley from the tdi compressor on a 1.6 compressor?
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no mount to fit.... so no not that simple... vr6 ac lines fitting a tdi comp... you may get lucky.. cause if a old 81 diesel ac comp fits tits perfect to a b3 passat 16v line... id think the fitting/compressor area will most likely cross bread... for 1 simple reason... 93 started r-134... vr6 started same time... id think a mk3 jetta/golf would use same fittings... as a 93 vr6 passat.. and the soonest they might change it up would be the 99.5 model change..
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B3 AAZ passat would have the correct lines right? It uses a serp belt.
guts modded or passat tdi wagon, 96-97 supposedly fits...
You're talking about the sending unit right? Why does it have to be from a wagon?
Sorry for thread jacking. I'm doing the same swap right now, except I don't think I'll use a TDI and it's auto.
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wagon has bigger tank I think so it need to be taller. good idea on aaz.
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tank height...
passat sedan has mini spare.. mk2 diesel fits no issue.. for float unit..
passat wagon has full sized spare and floor cutout for it even.. wagon only tank... good 2-3" height differance
thats the tank height differance... why wagons have 21+ gal tanks vs 18gal sedan...
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contemplating putting this engine in my jetta to test it out. when i get the pump for it.
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is wiring in the stock cluster glowplug light and turn key glowplugs a big task? I was thinking of wiring it to a sensor that would only enanble it to come on when outside temp is below a certain temp.
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tdi and glow plugs... hmmmmm still not wired mine up... started at 20*f no issue last winter when i tried...
reality is a push button for 5 sec is most i think you will ever need... a simple push button to a ford big boy style relay..
now if it were a idi you need them year round for quick starting even when warm..
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I used the stock '83 glow plug relay on my mTDI van. It works fine. I don't care if they come one when they aren't needed but definitely want them when I do need them. Wiring in the stock relay is a piece of cake.
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From tdi club
"for a/c there are at least two routes
1. use the mk2 evaporator in the dash and have a custom line from the evaporator to the compressor created and then a custom line from the the compressor to the condenser
2. use the mk3 evaporator and then use an SLC a/c line from the condensor to the evaporator. Use a mk3 TDI or ABA 2L or slc a/c line to the compressor from the evaporator. Have the compressor to the condenser line modified with the mk2 unit and tdi donor. My cost was $75 per a/c line for mods."
Number one seems like best option.
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Peritiant info for my swap in regards to fuel tank sending unit.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5814565-B3-Wagon-diesel-swap&p=79068481
Also fuel filter ideas? Chris what did you use? I think i would like to just run a rabbit spin on type housing. Is the fuel pre heater more necessary with tdi?
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Motor mounts..
16v have same motor mounts as a 1.6?
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Motor mounts..
16v have same motor mounts as a 1.6?
locations, bolt patterns and that sort of thing are all the same between the 16v and the diesel..
all VW EA811 blocks have identical motor mount locations and bosses.
why are you gonna swap it into one car to try it out, then pull it out to swap it into another car?
why dont you just perform one swap, ad try it out in the car that it was originally intended for?
or do you just have soo much time that a whole extra engine swap is no big deal for you?
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Motor mounts..
16v have same motor mounts as a 1.6?
locations, bolt patterns and that sort of thing are all the same between the 16v and the diesel..
all VW EA811 blocks have identical motor mount locations and bosses.
why are you gonna swap it into one car to try it out, then pull it out to swap it into another car?
why dont you just perform one swap, ad try it out in the car that it was originally intended for?
or do you just have soo much time that a whole extra engine swap is no big deal for you?
You got a point I have since ousted that grandiose idea.
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Motor mounts..
16v have same motor mounts as a 1.6?
locations, bolt patterns and that sort of thing are all the same between the 16v and the diesel..
all VW EA811 blocks have identical motor mount locations and bosses.
why are you gonna swap it into one car to try it out, then pull it out to swap it into another car?
why dont you just perform one swap, and try it out in the car that it was originally intended for?
or do you just have soo much time that a whole extra engine swap is no big deal for you?
You got a point I have since ousted that grandiose idea.
lol, just didnt make a whole lot of sense to perform an EXTRA engine swap, to test the engine out.. if you need to test it, fire it on an engine stand, haha.. ;)
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Motor mounts..
16v have same motor mounts as a 1.6?
locations, bolt patterns and that sort of thing are all the same between the 16v and the diesel..
all VW EA811 blocks have identical motor mount locations and bosses.
why are you gonna swap it into one car to try it out, then pull it out to swap it into another car?
why dont you just perform one swap, and try it out in the car that it was originally intended for?
or do you just have soo much time that a whole extra engine swap is no big deal for you?
You got a point I have since ousted that grandiose idea.
lol, just didnt make a whole lot of sense to perform an EXTRA engine swap, to test the engine out.. if you need to test it, fire it on an engine stand, haha.. ;)
Would it be a bad idea to fire it up with trans on it sitting on the floor? Basically i wanna fire it up before i drop it in after i install the libby pump. I don't get how i would do it on an engine stand with out the starter???
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Are the ALH block off plates for e.g.r. the same as the ones for the 1z?
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I'd drop it into the shell and bolt down the 3 motor mounts before firing it up on the floor. No need to hook up axles and wiring and all that if you just want to hear it run before investing hours into the swap.
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I'd drop it into the shell and bolt down the 3 motor mounts before firing it up on the floor. No need to hook up axles and wiring and all that if you just want to hear it run before investing hours into the swap.
x2
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Well I just found out this passat I'm buying is an autotrajic. The engine and trans will be gonecwhen I get it. I will def be going manual clutch cable now. What all extra crap will have to take out since its an auto? Other things I will/ wont have to do???
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Well I just found out this passat I'm buying is an autotrajic. The engine and trans will be gonecwhen I get it. I will def be going manual clutch cable now. What all extra crap will have to take out since its an auto? Other things I will/ wont have to do???
ive been driving cable clutches my whole life..
recently changed over to hydro clutch, and OH BOY, its SOO FRIGGEN NICE..
if i were you, i would just add the hydraulic clutch and all the good stuff to it..
you wont regret the smooth feel of the hydro clutch.. its SOO NICE!
02A cable operated trannies are harder to come by anyways.. and Eurovan clutch cables are STUPID EXPENSIVE..
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Well I just found out this passat I'm buying is an autotrajic. The engine and trans will be gonecwhen I get it. I will def be going manual clutch cable now. What all extra crap will have to take out since its an auto? Other things I will/ wont have to do???
ive been driving cable clutches my whole life..
recently changed over to hydro clutch, and OH BOY, its SOO FRIGGEN NICE..
if i were you, i would just add the hydraulic clutch and all the good stuff to it..
you wont regret the smooth feel of the hydro clutch.. its SOO NICE!
02A cable operated trannies are harder to come by anyways.. and Eurovan clutch cables are STUPID EXPENSIVE..
so for that id need.
1.clutch slave cylinder
2. master cylinder
3. pedal cluster
4. lines?
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Well I just found out this passat I'm buying is an autotrajic. The engine and trans will be gonecwhen I get it. I will def be going manual clutch cable now. What all extra crap will have to take out since its an auto? Other things I will/ wont have to do???
ive been driving cable clutches my whole life..
recently changed over to hydro clutch, and OH BOY, its SOO FRIGGEN NICE..
if i were you, i would just add the hydraulic clutch and all the good stuff to it..
you wont regret the smooth feel of the hydro clutch.. its SOO NICE!
02A cable operated trannies are harder to come by anyways.. and Eurovan clutch cables are STUPID EXPENSIVE..
so for that id need.
1.clutch slave cylinder
2. master cylinder
3. pedal cluster
4. lines?
its still a rather large conversion to go to cable clutch, because you have to find the actual cable that fits the 02A
then you have to find all the rest of the cable clutch setup..
its gonna be a swap, no matter what, so why not go for the nicer clutch setup?
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all I think with hydro clutch is those times id get in a friends car they push in the clutch and womp womp pedal to the floor. looks like we are walking today kids. happened once or twice.
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Change the evaporator under the dash to a 93-95 corrado/passat unit (mk3 apparently is different). You can use the AC lines and dryer from a 93 or latter passat. Make sure for the dryer to condenser line you stick with the B3 line. You need the later expansion valve as well.
You can use the intercooler and some pipes from a G60 syncro B3. A B4 TDI intercooler and all the pipes will also bolt in, but the front 'baffle' won't work with the B3 bumper.
There is no harm in using the 16V in tank unit the way it is. Just put keyed power to the pump. Don't try to pull fuel through a non-running lift pump, you will hurt the injection pump. A TDI unit from a B4 is also an option.
Glow plugs. If you can get your hands on an engine harness from a TD B3/B4, the glow plug module is part of that harness. Change the fuel pump relay in the fuse panel to a glow plug relay.
Use a diesel Eurovan or B3 cluster. You need the correct tach. Tach signal will come from the W plug on the alt.
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You can use the intercooler and some pipes from a G60 syncro B3. A B4 TDI intercooler and all the pipes will also bolt in, but the front 'baffle' won't work with the B3 bumper.
sounds tough to find and expensive. thanks for the idea on the other stuff!!
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well the guy you wanna talk too... crazy andy for the following parts...
shifter, boot, knob, clutch master/slave/lines.. i cannot say i trust them 100% but he has those parts and they fit passat aka shifter/boot/knob.. came from a b3... line-master-slave is cores/pieces..
sadly no pedals... i kept those for a vr6 swap in mk2...
i do not trust any them transfer pumps.. or the ait leak at the spring loaded squishy area..
i myself agree on hydro clutch.. when it screws you it hurts... but vs a cable so nice...
im not going back to see where this thread balloned up.. so hit me with pm on anything i missed...
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now that I have this engine I got tons of questions.
why 2 oil sensors?
crank sensor what should I do with that?
three post coolant sensor on end of the head? swap it for plastic one with proper temp sensor?
does this engine use the same kind of vac pump as a 1.6? looks the same to me. I need one the fitting is broke off mine.
#3 injector what's up with that sensor? should I get a regular injector since its gonna be mtdi?
What's up with this glowplug rail? are they all ***ty and cracked like this?
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Two oil sensors are for the dynamic oil pressure warning system. One reads at idle, the other above 2,000 rpms.
I've been planning to use the crank sensor (4 pulses per rev) and a flip flop to cut it in half in order to drive a tach on my mTDI, but haven't gotten a round toit.
Are you talking about the flange with the three coolant glow plugs? I've considered wiring them to come on when the heater fan gets turned on high but again need to get a round toit.
Vac pump is different. It's functionally the same, but the part that enters the block is larger and the o-ring is in a different position. The AAZ pump is the same, tho. I have fixed then by adding a check valve and barb nipple.
Check for continuity/resistance in the glow plug rail and if it's decent, use it. These usually don't even need the glow plugs.
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Two oil sensors are for the dynamic oil pressure warning system. One reads at idle, the other above 2,000 rpms.
I've been planning to use the crank sensor (4 pulses per rev) and a flip flop to cut it in half in order to drive a tach on my mTDI, but haven't gotten a round toit.
Are you talking about the flange with the three coolant glow plugs? I've considered wiring them to come on when the heater fan gets turned on high but again need to get a round toit.
Vac pump is different. It's functionally the same, but the part that enters the block is larger and the o-ring is in a different position. The AAZ pump is the same, tho. I have fixed then by adding a check valve and barb nipple.
Check for continuity/resistance in the glow plug rail and if it's decent, use it. These usually don't even need the glow plugs.
ive fixed them by just threading the plastic left where the old nipple was, and adding a barbed fitting..
there is a check valve at the brake booster, and one in the vac distribution manifold.. i didnt see a need for a 3rd check valve in a hose that runs roughly 14"
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plastic neck... you got to be kiddin me willis... aluminum 100% better... they do not break like plastic does..
libby ive always thought of running the glow plugs via 2 switches...
why.. ~15amp per pug...
if you wire it in 2 switches, you have a option of 1, then 2.. both = 3... think of it as some, more and max
ive thought bout adding the neck to my winter beater diesel for long time.. but 2 winters ago i moved so close to work i walk now... and that was the winter i got my tdi set up and saw i could add one to a old idi.. but wondered/pondered it for years before...
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the reason I said that is to accommodate the sensor that is there on the 1.6 but maybe that one isn't needed? Whats its purpose on the 1.6?
So the glowplugs on that flange enchance the interior heat?
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the reason I said that is to accommodate the sensor that is there on the 1.6 but maybe that one isn't needed? Whats its purpose on the 1.6?
So the glowplugs on that flange enchance the interior heat?
they dont really do a whole lot of anything, besides eat power..
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Yes, they enhance interior heat by adding a minuscule amount of heat to the coolant, but more importantly robbing power. By increasing the load on the engine it warms up faster. If you don't mind taking 15 minutes for decent cabin heat, then leave them off.
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Yes, they enhance interior heat by adding a minuscule amount of heat to the coolant, but more importantly robbing power. By increasing the load on the engine it warms up faster. If you don't mind taking 15 minutes for decent cabin heat, then leave them off.
lol, never thought about the added load to the engine, by way of the alternator..
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will a b4 bentley have most of the info I need for the tdi motor and the b3 car?
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The B4 Bentley is 2 huge books. It doesn't specifically cover the B3, but they are very similar. Since you are going mTDI, if you know your way around the IDIs the engine really isn't anything special. You could even get the MK3 Bentley covering the TDI. It would likely cost less than the Passat version.
This old WTB ad might be of some help
http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=31583.0
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Essentialy the only things wiring wise I need to hook up to the tdi is the 4 pin coolant sensor for the fan, the alternator, stop solenoid and starter stuff? glowplugs optional.
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b3 like mk2... fan sensor on rad... o 4 pn req... that coolent gauge and comp temp sensor....
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b3 like mk2... fan sensor on rad... o 4 pn req... that coolent gauge and comp temp sensor....
computer temp sensor?
So all i really need there is a 2 pin for the temp guage?
Also do i have to take off the black cover on the alt to get to the w terminal?
is all the wiring for the injection system and other computer related crap pretty easy to remove? is it all bundled together pretty well? i saw that it had some sort of wiring harness running up under the back seat.
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i saw that it had some sort of wiring harness running up under the back seat.
That's for the tranny's computer.
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will any dakota digital converters work to drive a gasser tach with the cps sensor on the tdi?
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The crank position sensor gives 4 pulses per rev. I've been planning on using a flip flop circuit to cut that signal in half and drive a gas tach. That signal would already be correct for any 8 cylinder 4-stroke tach.
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The crank position sensor gives 4 pulses per rev. I've been planning on using a flip flop circuit to cut that signal in half and drive a gas tach. That signal would already be correct for any 8 cylinder 4-stroke tach.
looks like this one would do the trick.
http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=127/category_id=287/home_id=59/mode=prod/prd127.htm
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will the speedo be cable driven on the auto cluster on the b3 im using?
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This is what I'm doing for a tach signal
http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=30442.0
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How can I clean out the intake ports on the head? I pulled my manifolds and there is some serious crud caked on the intake ports.
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http://compare.ebay.com/like/190576182920?var=lv<yp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar
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This stuff is caked on so thick like <1/4" is it the egr that causes it to cake up like this?
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It is EGR soot mixed with oil mist from the crank vent. Eliminate either one and it won't build up.
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Either pull the cam or rotate it so the valve is closed on the port you are working on. Then vacuum or blow it out.
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Would using a 96 passat vr6 for my project be a giant pain in the ars sinve its obd2?
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Since you are going mechnical i dont see why it should matter ?? Lol.
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Since you are going mechnical i dont see why it should matter ?? Lol.
From a removal of wiring standpoint. O2 sensors yada yada. I hate abs. I'm lookin to maybe do it with a 96 vr6 auto that's in bass shape with a bum trans for less than 2 grand only 60k on the body. I guess what I'm asking is will my brakes work by just disconnecting the abs control from the ecu when I take it out? The seller suggests I just get a b3 aaz harness.
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New receiver of my mtdi if all goes as planned.
http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/3321303085.html
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just to put my 0.02$ in, i would say that glowplugs are essential, not optional. Yes the care will start but i feel like it is very unhealthy for the engine especially on cold starts. The coolant glowplugs help get the engine up to operating temp faster as the tdis take longer to heat up than our IDI's. Im also going to vote for the hydro clutch, theyre really just as reliable as a cable if you use parts in good condition (maybe out of a b4 or ahu jetta? seeing as they're still available new)
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just to put my 0.02$ in, i would say that glowplugs are essential, not optional. Yes the care will start but i feel like it is very unhealthy for the engine especially on cold starts. The coolant glowplugs help get the engine up to operating temp faster as the tdis take longer to heat up than our IDI's. Im also going to vote for the hydro clutch, theyre really just as reliable as a cable if you use parts in good condition (maybe out of a b4 or ahu jetta? seeing as they're still available new)
I have decided on going hydro clutch.
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looks like the g60 flywheel by sachs and the vr6 clutch kit is the way to go.
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yep.... to clutch...
b4 = junk... b3 better quality...
abs sux... not easy to remove...
by the way.. the 97 passat tdi got hit when i was on my road trip... still working on the totaled or not aspect.. but complete tdi-e swap... all maintence done even..
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yep.... to clutch...
b4 = junk... b3 better quality...
How so? Their window reg's suck, sure but essentially the same cars. I've a bunch of them over the years. Looks-wise, the facelifted B4 wins hands down.
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yep.... to clutch...
b4 = junk... b3 better quality...
How so? Their window reg's suck, sure but essentially the same cars. I've a bunch of them over the years. Looks-wise, the facelifted B4 wins hands down.
I kinda like the space shuttle look of a white b3.
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b3 win reg/win tracks 1000x better then b4... screw with then every year on the 97 "rip" tdi but never 1 time in 11 on either of the b3s ive run...
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b3 win reg/win tracks 1000x better then b4... screw with then every year on the 97 "rip" tdi but never 1 time in 11 on either of the b3s ive run...
I agree the B4s regs suck. Makes one wonder if they were interchangeable?
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I agree the B4s regs suck. Makes one wonder if they were interchangeable?
They are. You have to drill 2 mounting holes and a pilot bushing hole to get the motor to swap over. I think it uses a different harness. A friend and I did it in a junkyard with basic tools so it is fairly easy to do. It was the drivers front window.
To be clear, we put a B3 regulator into a B4 using the B4 motor.
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I agree the B4s regs suck. Makes one wonder if they were interchangeable?
They are. You have to drill 2 mounting holes and a pilot bushing hole to get the motor to swap over. I think it uses a different harness. A friend and I did it in a junkyard with basic tools so it is fairly easy to do. It was the drivers front window.
To be clear, we put a B3 regulator into a B4 using the B4 motor.
Interesting to note. I've wrecked several B3s and never kept the regs. :P
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I'm feeling the hydro clutch so smooth and easy.
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I might go with .230 hflox nozzles any input?
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AAZ intake setup on its way to my house as is the M pump from Libby. All i need is a clutch, a starter and bracket and a few random bits and pieces and im ready for the surgery. Debating on re using the brand new 16v clutch that came on the passat i bought to put this motor in or spending the 400 on the g60 flywheel/vr6 clutch.. Going to be running stock k14 boost and a fuel setting that wont make any smoke. for now at least...
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passat has flywheel... so vr6 clutch/pplate....
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http://www.idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=2831 This is the kit ill be going with.
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save ~$100 and do not buy the flywheel... passat has one on it if 5 speed...
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save ~$100 and do not buy the flywheel... passat has one on it if 5 speed...
Actually there is a clutch kit and flywheel still on the motor i bought. Use this flywheel and get new pp and disc??
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If it's the right diameter you may as well.
Make sure you lighten your flywheel as well. It's much better.
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Libby pump has arrived!! woohoo its a thing of beauty...
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I thought lightened flywheels on diesels wasn't optimal? or is that just 1.6 idi?
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Much debate on the topic. I lost 4 pounds on my flywheel on my NA AAZ and that thing reved awesome, and it didn't vibrate excessively or anything strange.
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There is a thing of too light. I think the general consensus was around 65% of the aaz flywheel stock weight and it still was ok for vibration. I think zukgod1 had one that was 6lbs and said it was bad. Which would have been a tick less than 50% of stock weight. Stock weight was IIRC 12.8 lbs.
All 020 info btw
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My AAZ flywheel weighed 12.6 and was taken down to 8 lbs
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The current flywheel on my mTDI weighs 16.5 lbs. There's noticeably more vibration at idle. When I replace it to upgrade the clutch I will go with a stock weight one.
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..so some folks say lighter, some say stock, some say g60 flywheel which is 21 lbs?
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Lighter might be good for quick launch, but the price may be more vibrations and harmonics.
(My first VW had an aluminum flywheel, but that was a Beetle with a Corvair six.)
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all i need to know at this point is will this kit work on my flywheel? this kit paired with a smf flywheel says it will handle 275 ft lbs which will be fine for me should i expect the same results using this with a stock flywheel.
http://www.idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=2832
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The pressure plate and the disc determine the clamping force, not the flywheel (unless it is machined with the wrong distance between the two steps).
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Much debate on the topic. I lost 4 pounds on my flywheel on my NA AAZ and that thing reved awesome, and it didn't vibrate excessively or anything strange.
but you lose bottom end pull, right off the line..
there isnt as much spinning inertia, so it will take more pedal to keep everything spinning when you take off..
diesels dont rev that high, or that fast.. i see no need for a lightened flywheel..
ive run stock 19# wheels, stock 12# wheels, and even a 9 or 10# wheel once..
the 19# wheel really makes it hard to hook the tires up..
it just breaks them loose and turns them to smoke whenever you shift hard..
the lightened wheel was so weak, that i ended up separating the engine and trans just to switch back to a standard gasser flywheel..
my car shook worse, and it didnt have near as much pull right off the line..
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Yup Kev, I agree.. Lightened flywheels?? ARE WE RUNNING HONDA'S??
Wanna know what revs an engine up quicker? Faster boost and fueling ;)
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Yup Kev, I agree.. Lightened flywheels?? ARE WE RUNNING HONDA'S??
Wanna know what revs an engine up quicker? Faster boost and fueling ;)
making the engine breathe better improves throttle response..
when i changed from stock manifolds, to modified manifolds, i noticed a change in throttle response..
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Few updates.
1. tdi clutch disc and vr6 pressure plate
2. mk4 shifter conversion with Audi tt oe short shifter
3. pd150 with intake with racepipe e-g-r delete.
Still haven't started the work though yet.
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looking for some advice on IC.
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/221075431279
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/221075431279
i saw that one then i couldn't find it again thanks
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received the intercooler today really nice setup for the money.
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Did you go with the one I linked?
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whats sad is ill have to buy same kit... when we build bbobs.. its the proto for how ive wanted to do mine for years..
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It looks super quality. I am however hugely considering an AWIC setup :o
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if it same as my toaster.. pics look like it.. it is quality.. paid 75 for mine though.. but no boost pipes/couplers.. easy 75 in that alone.. unless your a lucky one and go tin on the autozone employee revenge of $1000s lost in pipe sale..
theman missed it by seconds... he was going to build shelves.. $75 before system crash.. thinking $27k next am.. LOL..
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yep got the linked ebay one. suckers heavy duty and so are the pipes.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jz0FqIrr54w
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Nice!
Build-log w/ pix in the works?
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aw a phonedial... :P
build.. hmmm not many pics.. just a libby pump tdi-m... my fmic set up i built.. no real pics of that... 1st real aluminum welding ive done with the tig.. :D tons of practice to that point though.. the whole piping set up is just so perfect like vw planned it..
i not driven yet.. went for pass ride when the antifreeze leak was going... stupid vw spring clamps.. if you think upper hose fun.. lower hose is more so..
serp belt.. b3 rad.. b4 tdi rad better choise and when and if he ever needs one needs to get one of them.. the lower rad hose is tight fit..
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Shoot. Was hoping for a how-to and watch-out-for.
I have a 1.6TD and an 02A waiting to go into a 93 auto, when I get the time.
Any war-stories of the bbob build would be good to hear.
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Shoot. Was hoping for a how-to and watch-out-for.
I have a 1.6TD and an 02A waiting to go into a 93 auto, when I get the time.
Any war-stories of the bbob build would be good to hear.
its quite honestly straight forward swap. I may come thru toledo at some point and you can check it. Biggest thing is custom radiator hoses. have to figure out something with glowplugs. i also reccomend using 02j shifter assembly very easy to make work. Allso use a tdi clutch disc and vr6 pressure plate. wiring is easy really had to remove maybe 5-6 wire out of the main engine harnesses. Only issue we are having now is the tach not working.... we have it all hooked up right supposedly but no tach reading... im using an aaz b3 cluster.
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^^that post from me not crs
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10-4, thanks gents.
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he had picked my brain as in 02 and in 06 i put 1.6td with 020 in passats... i took the stuff from the one i built in 02 and put in wagon in 06..
so yes knowledge.. lots of it... his on 02j shift tower is reason why i cannot see me ever doing one.. but it does not feel bad... just the fiasco it was..
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l gotta drive today..
comparing to...
1.6td w/020 passat b3 wagon.. stock 83 td turbo, no ic no pump mods.. but one of the few "stock" runs great ones
97 tdi-e b4 5 speed sedan..
my toaster, tdi-m w rover pump, stock little turbo.. same fmic, 2.5" straight pipe.. some unknown upgrade nozzles
rember.. pump stock settings set to 1.20 made by libby.. stock 1z injectors.. so on.. he has a "upgraded turbo listed in this thresd..
midrange im not "impressed with.. seems to peeter out.. which means no big rpm either.. fueling/injectors and timming need to be played with still.. so ill see how bbob gets it dialed in and go for another ride in a few mo.. give him time to dial it in.. and see how it is..
as far as vs other m pumps vids sounds so on.. rover and libby pumps are quiet.. no loud clanks or anything at this time on either.. same sound as most tdi-e IMO.. next week he drives home.. id have taken today.. but he has to be somewhere and breaking new build on way home bad idea..
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Getting in my jetta and driving home was painful compared to tdi passat. ;D
I think once I turn up fue,l up the timing and bigger injectors I will be pulling good power.
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My test vehicle has upgraded injectors. On these pumps, I set the max fuel to 1200°F which, IMO, is a very moderate level of fueling. I intentionally 'err' on the side of under-fueling with the max fuel screw setting. I do that to ensure that someone's engine will not be over-fueled and consequently damaged from excessive combustion temps when they initially install one of my pumps. Installing that pump on an engine with stock injectors will further limit max fuel. Due to differences in my test vehicle, injectors, turbo and max boost, for best performance, someone installing one of my pumps will need to tune the max fuel and consequently the idle once the pump is installed. IMO, all other settings on the pumps I build are tuned optimally and so should not be adjusted. Once someone has an EGT gauge installed, they can adjust the max fuel to their liking/desired risk. I personally opt for max EGTs in the 1200°-1300° range on my own vehicles.
To initially set the timing on my test vehicle I use a diesel pulse adapter with piezo pickup along with a stroboscopic timing light and set the timing to 12° BTDC @ 900 rpms and find that setting to be optimal. I do measure the plunger lift of each pump using the dial gauge after the timing is set using my pulse adapter and timing light in order to be able to give a reasonable range, but again, differences in injectors affect timing and so, giving a specific plunger lift spec that will be optimal with someone else's set of injectors is not possible. 1.20 is a decent starting point for bbob's pump. If someone has installed one of my pumps and has found that EGTs in the 1200-1300° range result in visible smoke, then the next step in tuning should be to advance the timing in very small increments. If the engine gets to a point of significant diesel clatter before clearing the smoke at that max EGT range, then upgraded injectors are indicated for that power setting. If anyone with one of my pumps is able to visit my location, I am happy to optimally dial in their timing and max fuel for their specific engine/injectors/turbo.
If there is anything lacking in mid-range or upper rpm power it may be as simple as adjusting the timing and max fuel or may require an injector or turbo upgrade. The pumps I sell are definitely not the limiting factor to power potential.
I look forward to hearing more updates.
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why i said that :D also why i say ill give him a few mo to dial it in.. no one will find the sweet spot in a day..
now to teach bbob how to do only 1 thing at a time till set... to do 2 adjustments at 1 time you will not know what 1 did.. say bad thing happens.. egt spike for example.. max fuel and timming played with... which of the 2 did it..
so ill discuss noting all adjustments down.. so if a negative happens he can "turn back" what he did..
ive watched too many people screw up in rc nitro carb tuning/suspention adj as they do not work on 1 aspect at a time.. gotta screw with it all and then tend to get forced to start from scratch..
but yes im waiting to see how it goes.. and i can totally beleive its fuel.. but same token only saw 1k on egt when i did 5th gear pull from 65 to 85.. no soot clouds.. but sadly the tail pipe set up will disperse that.. not far enough away from bumper.. so under car air kills watching that..he needs 3" more tail pipe..
i played with tail pipe lenngth on my b3 wagon.. how to disperse the soot so it did not fill my cargo area opening in soot.. gap around the hatch opening.. i used my wagon as my pit table set up for rc nitro racing.. white car w/soot looks like poo when working out the back of it.. ill need to host one of then pics one day...
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.205 nozzles are in order.
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Bumping this thing back up. Its going to be winter soon so Im thinking about glow plugs. I really want to build a full turn key setup w/ temperature cut off. That being said I have a few questions/ ideas.
Here is the sensor i use for the aux temp guage on my A-pillar. My thinking with this is to T it and run another nail sensor for the glow plug system or Drill and tap one of the glow plug bosses on the coolant flange on the end of the head.
(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b75/bendover817/2013-09-24135333_zpsa0113fa5.jpg) (http://s17.photobucket.com/user/bendover817/media/2013-09-24135333_zpsa0113fa5.jpg.html)
Next question as far as i can tell the glow plug relay occupies the same space that the fuel pump relay used to be. What do i need to do with the wiring in the harness/fuse box to make the glow plug relay work in that spot? Is it even worth using or should i just wire up the glow plug relay independent the fuse box?
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I took the difficult route and pulled the fuse box apart on my 85 golf and modified the fuel pump relay socket to accept the glowplug relay. You can create a stanalone harness if you wish. In reality this route will be much quicker as I had to source a few connectors that were not present. If you use the TDI glowplug setup you "may" be able to just use the tdi temp sensor in its normal location.
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no t... will be a dead end coolent passage with 0 flow... for this.. a mk3 tdi with ac.. bet ya aaz with ac too.. has a top rad hose with a temp sensor spot for the 2 wire kill ac if overheating circuit (white sensor, you need the 2 wire black gauge style 89+but sensors same size)... for what your seeking.. that will work as a glow plug sensor... just not accurate for a gauge as no real flow till thermostat is open.. but glow plugs hot/cold/mid temp.. heck yea.. perfect..
wire glow plug relay under hood...
no temp probe required... will just run max time out.. will shut off 3 or so sec after you hit the key... just like a idi is... yes the glow plugs in stock form glow while/during cranking till abou t3-5 seconds after it runs... even when warm it ignites the glow plugs when cranking and shuts off 3-5 sec after running...
now tdi.. has completly different glow system vs idi... no idea the relay they use.. but it only lasts even dead of winter 5 to 10 sec... that ive seen... and with no glowplugs.. 20f is a few extra revolutions of the engine.. but honestly it still lights faster then a idi with 1 bad one... alot faster.. ive seen some idi that do not..
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I have a glowplug relay from a mk2 i was going to use. and i definitely want the dash light to work. Not going to run it through any kind of pimped setup with a solenoid because heck this thing doesn't need to extra juice just a bit of heat on a cold erie morning.
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Part of me wants to gut the interior rip out all the wiring and redo it all and get rid of all the *** i don't need like the alarm wiring still in there and a host of other things in the big rats nest behind the the kneebar.
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Front bilstein hd struts showed up today too!
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to kill alarm, power locks is how it works... all those added wires are very few in reality... just added switch for trunk lock, and hood.. rest of wires run domelights, power locks so on... come look at the b4 harness.. :P then pear under my b3 back seat..
what you want is a 2.slow b4 w manual windows, mirrors... few b3 out there... but b3 has seat belt crap... for a minimualist harness in the b3... maybe canadian harness for a b3 aaz one... that lacks power would be best...
but wire in the glow plug light.. not that hard.. then wire glow plug relay under hood... the "temp sensor wire" in can operate the light... and i know we kept a extra few wire on the engine harness for this thought...
idi glow plug relay on tdi i do not suggest though.. they work too much on a idi when a tdi does not need... like when cranking... you need to look into what tdi use... i know it somehow deals with the comp.... check ngine light issues with them..
keep that receipt... they suck arss on warentee...
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Bumping this thing back up. Its going to be winter soon so Im thinking about glow plugs. I really want to build a full turn key setup w/ temperature cut off. That being said I have a few questions/ ideas.
Here is the sensor i use for the aux temp guage on my A-pillar. My thinking with this is to T it and run another nail sensor for the glow plug system or Drill and tap one of the glow plug bosses on the coolant flange on the end of the head.
(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b75/bendover817/2013-09-24135333_zpsa0113fa5.jpg) (http://s17.photobucket.com/user/bendover817/media/2013-09-24135333_zpsa0113fa5.jpg.html)
Next question as far as i can tell the glow plug relay occupies the same space that the fuel pump relay used to be. What do i need to do with the wiring in the harness/fuse box to make the glow plug relay work in that spot? Is it even worth using or should i just wire up the glow plug relay independent the fuse box?
Unless you are really partial to that connector couldn't you cut it off and add a new one with an extra wire coming off of it to give signal to your glow plugs?
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Bumping this thing back up. Its going to be winter soon so Im thinking about glow plugs. I really want to build a full turn key setup w/ temperature cut off. That being said I have a few questions/ ideas.
Here is the sensor i use for the aux temp guage on my A-pillar. My thinking with this is to T it and run another nail sensor for the glow plug system or Drill and tap one of the glow plug bosses on the coolant flange on the end of the head.
(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b75/bendover817/2013-09-24135333_zpsa0113fa5.jpg) (http://s17.photobucket.com/user/bendover817/media/2013-09-24135333_zpsa0113fa5.jpg.html)
Next question as far as i can tell the glow plug relay occupies the same space that the fuel pump relay used to be. What do i need to do with the wiring in the harness/fuse box to make the glow plug relay work in that spot? Is it even worth using or should i just wire up the glow plug relay independent the fuse box?
Unless you are really partial to that connector couldn't you cut it off and add a new one with an extra wire coming off of it to give signal to your glow plugs?
I thought of that just wasn't sure if it would mess up the guage signal.
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seeing as how it is a resistance reading.. you may be right??
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Yeah have to ask CRSMP5 as he want to YSU for electrical edumacation. I honestly don't know but would give it a shot and see.
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back in 93 i learned that no work by trial... why we went thru tigging nut to pipe for gauge as i explained then.... else llook up current divider... that sensor would be the joinning place... why engineers have proved it no work..
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What if you added/continued the wire from the back of the gauge?
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google voltage divider...
each gauge think of as a resistor... sensor as a resistor...
if you draw this out.. it would be like a shape of a y.. gauges up top.. sensor at bottom... does it matter where you tap into the sensor signal? no matter how you draw it, think of it.. it will still be a Y
you have same issue with light up 2 position switches if your running a switch to share water/oil temps on the single gauge... key word light up switch.. non-light-up ones work great to change sensors... and with enough of those switches i gues you could share 1 sensor on 2 guges... but for what he needs a sensor for.. not needed.. no matter what the glow plugs will be on when not needed to be with a idi style glow plug set up...
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I wonder if you could use the alt exciter circuit as a switch. Prior to the alt being excited, use the sensor to power the glow relay. Afterward have it power the gauge. Hmmm.
It's all academic, tho. Easier just to tap the metal flange for another sensor...
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he could goto a non glowplug neck and solve it all... but he is worried on something that matters so little its not even worth this discussion..
i really do wonder how rover did their tdi m stuff before they went electric... and how the glow plugs work on their older idi vs the tdi...
honestly... a tdi will start in tempd a idi will not when their glow plug gives a issue... major differance in cold weather...
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he could goto a non glowplug neck and solve it all... but he is worried on something that matters so little its not even worth this discussion..
What? ???
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I have used the mk2 relay. I don't mind that it has the glow plugs run more than necessary. This site and the Bentley both have the pinout. I also have used the early aluminum coolant flange that had two sensors, one for glow plugs and one for the gauge.
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I think maybe what CRS was trying to say is that the coolant glow plugs are not worth the effort and installing an earlier neck with two sensors is the easy way.
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I was unaware that the older neck would fit i assumed it was different since the front is different.... I tossed the ones i had a few months ago it was pretty crusty though. Im sure i can scrounge one up.
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no.. i told you the old idi ones fit... back when we made the tap in the pipe for a sensor... but you wanted to wire in those glow plugs in the neck...
my worry libby is the harness for the glow plugs.. unlike a idi buss bar its got silly wires that fail... set off the check light.. and i know how warm a 8gauge wire gets with a single glow plug on it... aka testing them off batt to see if the work or not... the wire in a tdi glow plug system seems under size to me.. the longer they stay on.. the hotter the wire will get.. and melt..
so thats why i have a issue with it...
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Wondering where I would plug in the wire to activate glow plug light. I have had no problem with the 10 guage wire on the glow plugs on my mk2.
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When I installed the ALH in my '91 Vanagon I installed the glow plug relay and most of the wiring but didn't finish the dash light or the actual harness to the glow plugs. When I got my '02 Jetta Wagon, the PO gave me a new glow plug harness and told me that the DTC for glow plugs had be tripped and so he got the harness to swap in but hadn't gotten around to it. I figured I'd install the new harness on the Jetta and install the old harness from the Jetta into the Vanagon using the mk2 glow plug relay. Yesterday morning it was below freezing here and so the '91 had trouble starting without glow plugs and so I figured I should get to it. I swapped the Jetta harness and finished the glow plug install on the '91 today. The pinout for the glow plug relay is fairly simple and listed on this site in this thread (http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=27695.0). The '91 has a couple of extra wires running front to back and I used one of those for the light. I pulled apart the cluster and installed a radioshack yellow LED into one of the blank LED slots. I had to install a 5K ohm resister on it, tho, to reduce it's brightness down to match the other idiot lights. I spent a stupid amount of time trying to troubleshoot the system. It turned out that BOTH of the NEW glow plug relays that I had on hand were not working properly!! One of them did not function at all and the other one would trigger the glow plugs but not the instrument cluster LED. After a considerable amount of time spent with the Bentley wiring diagrams and the multi-meter, I finally swapped in the relay from my '79 rabbit and it all worked as it should [bangs head on desk]. For wiring in the ALH glow plug harness, I just cut the four glow plug wires (14g) to the same length and did a crimp/solder/heat shrink connection on it to the relay. The '79 relay is the slow glow relay and so I will update that to the fast plugs. I was also thinking that I might do some resistance readings on the temp sensor and add a resistor to drop the temp a bit so the glow plugs come on less often and for a shorter duration as the TDI hardly needs them.
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so the glow plugs come on less often and for a shorter duration as the TDI hardly needs them.
Been hovering around freezing all last week here too, glow plugs aren't even wired up on my M-TDI right now. Doesn't need them at all. Starts the same way at any temp this year so far. The two idi's in the driveway though.. need them indefinitely.
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Im thinking i will use 14ga wire them up in series? or individual? then to a single 50-60amp maxi fuse to push button activated starter solenoid.
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I'd feel better larger than 14g for individual glow plugs but that's what the ALH harness is. I would not run them in series with 14g wire. If making up the harness I would use 4 separate 12g or 10g wires. I used (2)10g wires to run from starter lug to a 50 amp fusible link and then (2)10g wires from the other side of the link to the 30 terminal on the relay. The momentary switch and starter solenoid is a fine way to go also, but i like to keep it simple for my wife. "Wait for the yellow light to go out, then crank it over."
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"Wait for the yellow light to go out, then crank it over."
:)
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I have an aaz cluster so i already have a light just don't know how to make it "glow"..
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your push button will power it.. or i think tapping in a lead with glow plugs so if button fails or your under hood relay fails or fuse, the light will not work..
just figure out what pin into or out of fuse box goes to it...
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I am not familiar with the AAZ cluster but I imagine it is basically the same as the vanagon cluster. I just followed the two traces that came off the LED socket I wanted to use. One joined one side of the other LEDs, the other went to one of the cluster connector pins. The connector plug was missing that pin, so I added it from the box of spare wiring bits and wired it to the L connection on the relay. I did need to flip the LED around because I got the polarity wrong.
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Got some Meyle hd strut mounts in today and some vr6 front springs and bilstein hd front struts! Time for some decent suspension already.
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his aaz is same as eurovan... but has gp led in it...
look at how those bearings are plastic vs normal ones... the ones your taking off both sides are steel.. the upper part i think is plastic on the vr6 hd style upper mounts... yea they wear... makes things bind up...
what bout the tt lower arm bushings?? you want them too..
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yea tt bushing in months ago. I noticed these are plastic. I had some vr style mounts off a car from the junker and the used bearings are all metal. So the old style must be metal new replacements not unfortunatelty.
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well what i guess im trying to say is stock non hd replacement better for long life... and no the stock vr6 ones ive delt with are plastic.. the balls wear into the plastic and jam up... ialso think the stock non hd will sit higher.. much more rubber to body contact... raising the car up a few mm.. which is what one of your goals is