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Engine Specific Info and Questions => TDI Engine -General Info => Topic started by: 935racer on September 04, 2006, 01:01:34 am
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Heres the deal, my daily driver MB TD is getting old (517,xxxkms, still tickin) and I am looking for something a little more exciting to drive. I figured I had pretty much all the major pieces needed to build a pretty exciting turbo diesel so away I go. The goal is to make 250WHP and 400ft/lbs of torque, everyday, reliably. I want to do this on a very resonable budget, no crazy maching, gonna use stock pistons etc.
I have a ALH longblock sitting in my shop, its pretty bare, but low milage and I'll come up with the rest of the parts. I also just recently aquired a TDI o2a transmission, so I will use that. I also just bought malones old 97 golf, yes the one that I put together with the 1.6/1.9 franken engine, don't worry that engine will get more freaky, just in a older and lighter chasis :D
The plans of as now:
ENGINE: 70,000kms on long block
Give bottom end a quick rebuild, balance the bottom end, add total seal gapless rings, machine pistons, ceramic coat tops of pistons, add arp rod bolts and main and head studs, new bearings, polish rods, powder coat block, new gaskets etc.
Head: Full rebuild, intense porting work, new valves, 3 or 5 angle valve job, one of my custom cams, my new custom tubular manifolds, upgraded valve springs(suggestions?)
Fuel injection: starting with a brand spankin new cummins 6bt pump, a used core ALH electronic 10mm tdi pump, governor and throttle assembly from a 1.6 pump, a complete 1.6td pump top, and the only 14mm custom made head in north america, thanks to red rotors for hooking that up.
Giles will be building this pump, as much as I want to build it myself I have no idea what to set the plunger prestroke and stuff at because I have no reference point, Giles is the man for this job and he can bench test it before I throw it on the motor. I will be using a high pressure lift pump to supply fuel and a large fuel cooler to keep the temps down.
Mark Malone (www.dieselinside.com) is hooking me up with some rc520's for the injectors until someone makes something bigger and badder.
Water injection: I will build myself and will incorporate a resevoir, a high pressure pump and 4 misters, one for each intake runner, comming from something much like a fuel rail, I might try and rig up some sort of fuel pressure regulator to control fuel with boost pressure.
Tranny: I am going to swap a TDI o2a with hydraulic clutch and cable shift into the chasis originally equipped with the o2o cable clutch and rod/linkage shifter. The tranny itself has 80,000miles on it and will have to remain stock until a later date where I can dump the cash into a peloquin and a full rebuild. I am praying I do not blow it up, no drag racing for a while.
Clutch and Flywheel: Clutch is a brand new VR6 Spec stage 3 with a 6 puck solid disk, it is rated to 444ftlbs of torque, perfect! Flywheel will be a 228mm lightened and balanced.
Turbo Detail: New Passenger Performance Race series custom tubular intake and exhaust manifolds including a custom compound turbo charger setup. I will be using a precision front mount air to air aftercooler.
And heres the kicker, I want to start the engine by mid october and have it dialed and driving by the end of october, pretty hectic but I want to try anyways.
Pictures to come! Hopefully this thread will keep me focused and motivated. Feel free to comment and ask questions.
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935racer i love it to just follow youre project!
250WHP :shock:
start posting pics :D
Greetz, Benjamin
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upgraded valve springs if I can find some (if anyone has a source please tell).
The dual valve springs from an earlier diesel (with 8mm valve stems) are the hot ticket in gasser land, and certainly an upgrade from the ALH single springs. The added bonus is that you probably have them "in stock".
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Yeah I already have some new dual springs from early 8mm 1.9td heads, I really want to make a tool to check the clamping pressures for springs, its just a matter of when I can sneak into my buddys shop and use his lathe.
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I'm using the Crane Cams gasser springs PN#CRN99879-8.They are a good bit stronger than the dual diesel springs.When boosting over 30psi I believe these are a must!
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Thanks Andy! I'll be looking into those springs for sure, what was the cost on those bad boys?
First update: pulled off the oil pan, oil pump, and removed pistons and rods.
One thing I noted is that the 2nd compression ring and the oil ring on pistons and 1+4 were siezed, yet there was no cylinder wall scoring. The rings were just stuck, not broken, seems to be excessive carbon build up. Coincidence? I think not, I am blaming the pathetic intake manifold for this one. Pistons and rods are sitting in the parts washer tonight, hopefully I can free the rings in the morning and get some pictures up tomorrow.
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http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch.asp?Ntt=CRN-99879-8&x=27&y=14&searchinresults=false&Ntk=KeywordSearch&DDS=1&N=700+400078+115
about $60 us
Ill probably get a set
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Dang thats cheap, definately grabbing some of those.
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Just out of curiosity, are you going to o-ring the block or head for piece of mind?
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I don't think I'll bother O ringing, I am not planning on running over 40 psi, so not too much boost, I've got headstuds and my gasket goo along with lowered compression, I think I'llbe fine
Oh and I got the rings out today! So happy about that, definately good I didn't try to just run the engine as is. I also started to polish the rods, its late now maybe pics tomorrow.
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I'll be watching closely, those are numbers that I am really hoping to get with my "twincharged" TDI idea. (still just that, an idea.) :( Good luck!
Brendan
84 Scirocco 8v
00 Camaro L36 M49
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Whats your twin charge idea? Blower to snail?
I am trying to figure out how to upload pics to my new computer, I've got two of the rods pretty much completed, takes about 2.5 hours a rod. :? These rods take twice as long to polish as the IDI ones.
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Paging Malone to Dave's house! We need pic's :P
(Is this motor going to run a prototype of youre advance mechanism?)
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Initially no, I won't need the extra advance because I will not be revving the 14mm head very high, not likely over 5000rpm, unless giles comes up with some magic. If I blow the 14mm (please no) than I will go down to a 12mm head and than I can use one of my prototype timing advance mechanisms.
Looks like me and Farrel are gonna run soem base flow #'s on the head this weekend and maybe start some porting and piston machining.
My bro just came and stole my camera for the day, so I am gonna have to wait until evening to get some pics up, but I'll pin him down and make him upload my pictures onto this computer. I have 3 rods almost done now, I want to make sure the pics are good before I polish the last one so you can all see what kind of work I am doing.
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Nice job, i wish i got the possibility to do the internals!
i hope you got youre cam back soon :P
and than I can use one of my prototype timing advance mechanisms.
you ever said maybe you should post it, do you still working on it :D
Greetz, Benjamin
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Whats your twin charge idea? Blower to snail?
Yep. Not sure which blower or what type at the moment. A centrifugal would be nice because of the relatively small space but they are known to be very inefficient. I was thinking an Eaton roots-type from a GM 3800 SC would work well but space may be a factor. I'd love to have a lysholm but there's that whole money thing. (the reason why I dont even have the engine yet!!!!!) I'm thinking blower to small intercooler, like the stock TDI one- to the turbo, up to the gutted rain tray into an air-water intercooler, then back down to the fabbed intake. This keeps the total amount of tubing quite short and the air should be fairly cool as well. I've got some sketches and have made some measurements and it looks like it would really be pretty simple.
But this isnt about me, it's about the guy who actually has the hardware in his hands. Carry on! I'll be watching! :twisted:
Brendan
84 Scirocco 8v
00 Camaro L36 M49
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Centrifugal superchargers are VERY efficient (in terms of adiabatic efficiency). Much better than roots style etc.
935Racer - sounds like a great project. Keep us updated of the progress!
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There's a guy near me selling an E/R MP62 for $250 CDN, if you want it.
http://www.clubveedub.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=16909
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Finally some pics, nothing too cool yet but don'y worry its all under works.
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6792.jpg)
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6793.jpg)
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6794.jpg)
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6795.jpg)
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6796.jpg)
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6797.jpg)
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6798.jpg)
My custom 14mm pump plunger vs the stock 9mm (injection pump head):
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6800.jpg)
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6801.jpg)
(http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l83/935racer/CIMG6802.jpg)
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nice pics 8)
What is the benefit of polished rods?? :oops: (i assume you also have to balande them?)
Greetz, Benjamin
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Polished rods have fewer sharp edges and therefore fewer stress risers, or places where failure might occur. Really need to shot-peen them, too.
Nice polish job.
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wow! i cant wait til im up in seattle, im going to have to drive out to PP and see what the deal is hands on
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Yep polishing the rods gets rid of stress risers left from the forging process, the main thing is that large ridge left on the beam, that really needs to get blended out, most people leave the center section of the rod, but I have the tools to do it all so I will. And yes the rods need to be shot peened afterwards, I will do that later this week and maybe even cryo the rods. I will likely also resize them with ARP hardware and put new bushings in as well balance the rods.
Remember that when you polish rods ALWAYS polish/sand with the length of the rod, never across, this will create different stress risers weakening the rod. You have be super careful polishing rods or you really will make them much worse than were originally. Its a job for steady hands and an ELECTRIC die grinder, if you have head porting tooling and experience you'll be fine, if not do your homework and practice on some scrap rods first.
Thanks for the props 8)
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arp doesnt make rod bolts
well,they said they would make custom ones for me
unless something has changed since i built my engine ,there are no aftermarket rod bolts avalable for tdi's
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I know they have a few watercooled rod bolts to choose from, I was hoping one of them would fit the tdi rods, I havent gotten to that point yet however but I will post my findings here when the time comes.
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Raceware might have some too - haven't checked in a long time.
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Yep polishing the rods gets rid of stress risers left from the forging process, the main thing is that large ridge left on the beam, that really needs to get blended out, most people leave the center section of the rod, but I have the tools to do it all so I will. And yes the rods need to be shot peened afterwards, I will do that later this week and maybe even cryo the rods. I will likely also resize them with ARP hardware and put new bushings in as well balance the rods.
Remember that when you polish rods ALWAYS polish/sand with the length of the rod, never across, this will create different stress risers weakening the rod. You have be super careful polishing rods or you really will make them much worse than were originally. Its a job for steady hands and an ELECTRIC die grinder, if you have head porting tooling and experience you'll be fine, if not do your homework and practice on some scrap rods first.
is this all you need to know before you begin on the polish job?
oh, wich tool did you use on the electric die grinder (how hard/soft, dont know the right word in english :oops: )
Are polished conrods a must-have when you going for big power block?
or is this just a little bit better than stock?
Greetz, Benjamin
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you dont "need"polished rods
its just when you are going for it all,its added insurance against breakage hopefully