VWDiesel.net The IDI, TDI, and mTDI source.
General Information => Troubleshooting => Topic started by: slavik19 on February 18, 2012, 09:52:08 pm
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hey guys i have a mk1 style 1.6d injection pump.
it recently started leaking the engine sat for a while.
it prob never been rebuilt.
i cant afford to have it rebuilt.
i cant figure out where its leaking from.
drop of fuel every 2 secs.
and its getting worst.
what seals to check for? why is it leaking?
looks like its coming out the side where the fuel lines are connected.
i checked all the fuel lines and other bolts all tight.
can i fix this myself?
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slavik19 to answer your question- can i fix this myself? Yes, there is a kit that replaces all the internal o rings and gaskets and you need to get the front seal as well. This site has a great pictorial on what it is you need to do when rebuilding the pump. Read the pictorial and order up the parts from any of the many online places out there. Fix is like 50 bucks total if I remember correctly.
DAS
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found the link
http://crustycrank.com/resealinjpump.htm#injpump
this is prob the seal thats bad in my pump
(http://crustycrank.com/reseal17.jpg)
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Easy peasy fix. Some folks have even done it on the car. It is a matter of getting the pump to come apart enough to slide the o ring on the outside of the pump without actually taking the pump completely apart. There are four bolts that hold the corners on and you loosen them all but don't let the pump come apart.
Then take a bolt out all the way. slip behind the o ring with a piece of hooked rod or a thin screwdriver and stretch it out enough to get the bolt back in. Go around all corners until the bad o ring is on the outside of the pump and roll it back and off.
New O rings will be stiffer and some tape the outside of the pump with masking tape or duct tape to protect the new ring. Install is in reverse. One thing you do have to do is find a longer bolt that goes in the middle of the pump where the plug is. That plug comes out and you install a gauge to measure the throw of the piston to time the engine. But in this case you want to be able to put some pressure on the end of the piston to hold it in place otherwise when you release the pressure when you back off the pump head all the internals come apart. Not a good thing. Then you are forced to remove the pump from the car and really have a big rebuild to do.
Sliding the o ring off is doable by anyone with the proper precautions. Search the thread I think someone had this discussion going just a bit ago.
Do it, that diesel really is hard to get rid of out of the concrete driveway. And if blacktop it eats it away.
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I've done 3 or 4 of those "on the car" without removing the Inj Pump.
You can buy just that O-Ring from a Bosch Certified diesel repair shop.
$2-3-4 iirc, and it will be green.
There is more to be known to do a fool-proof job on this than what is included within that tutorial you linked. But that is a good general basis to start with.
I walked Steevz through the finer points in one of his recent threads, in conjunction with the crustycrank tutorial. Shouldn't take too long to find it.
Either here in T-shooting section or IDI section.
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thanks for the help guys ill be calling the stealership tommarrow.
and re-reading this while i do it.
also while on the injection pump topic i noticed Governor mods and timming advances.
i understand that timming should be pretty simple. i know i have a timming tool somewhere around my garage. it came with the gasser. hope its the same stuff.
better mpg and acceleration
givernor mod seems really good.
what am i actually doing? cut the spring shorter?
is it hard to get to disassmble then assemble.
thanks again guys really helpfull
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VW Dealer more than likely will not service that O-Ring.
If they "can/will" get it for you - probably 5X-10X the price.
Go to the yellow pages and find a diesel repair shop.
Be prepared they will tell you it cannot be done without failure - unless pump is removed and disassembled.
Don't argue or debate - just get the O-Ring - and thank them for the advice.
Pump Head O-Ring # 2 460 210 012 (Bosch part #)
To do the timing precisely on our IDI's you have to have a dial indicator gauge and an adapter for it to screw into the Inj Pump. So that might not be the same as what the gasser came with. Unless it was a piezo timing light that reads pulses from the fuel injector lines. Gassers usually just use a conventional timing light that reads signals from spark plug wires.
You can adjust the timing by ear - moving pump towards the engine advances the timing - moving it towards the radiator retards the timing. Just don't go too much advanced - just to finest point without excess rattle.
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If you've never timed a diesel before, I'd get a dial gauge. We know our TD pretty well and always use the gauge. Nice to get the numbers exact.
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There is a big potential pratfall with this method, if the pump plunger comes too far with the head then some of the shims can fall out into the guts of the pump and destroy it, if you are unlucky. There are tricks to prevent this, so make sure whatever guide you use mentions this. If it doesn't, then they were lucky. ;D
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i messed everything up. i decided to take the nozzel things off the pump so i wouldent have to stretch the seal as much. the nozzel tips the metal fuel lines connect to. well it broke off. i try welding a bolt on. no luck. heat it up keeps cracking. i need a new pump. and so broke at the moment. need my financial aid money like now
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That sucks, are all your parts rusty? Maybe somebody impacted them on instead of proper torque?
Looks like your cheapeast route might be to go on ebay and get a parts pump? Then you could get a cheap reseal kit on ebay and break down and clean your pump, swap parts then get back on the road.
I did the high end seal once. Then I got another leak and said screw it and pulled the pump and resealed everything.
If you have tools and a vice taking apart one of these pumps is no big deal.
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i messed everything up. i decided to take the nozzel things off the pump so i wouldent have to stretch the seal as much. the nozzel tips the metal fuel lines connect to. well it broke off. i try welding a bolt on. no luck. heat it up keeps cracking. i need a new pump. and so broke at the moment. need my financial aid money like now
why did you take the delivery valves out? or try taking them out?
the pump head is bigger than the area that those delivery valves take up..
you HAVE TO stretch the seal to get it on, no matter what.. the DIYs dont mention removing the delivery valves for a GOOD REASON.
and if you feel it necessary to remove them, use an impact gun to do so. they tend to come loose alot easier when you use some impact to loosen them, rather than sheer twisting torque.. delivery valves are thin and weak as you found out..
a new pump head/plunger will get you fixed right up..
i imagine you can score one for a few bucks from one of us ;D
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yea i know you can call me a dumbass one more time. at the time is looked like a good idea. its unbelieve how tight it was. tried welding a bolt onto what ever of the nozzel was left no luck. so im screwed right now. borrowing money. i have a 1.9tdi pump laying around is the pump head the same?
my pump worked well. just recently started leaking. im afraid if i take the head off a whole bunch of springs are going to jump out.
what do you guys think about these?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VW-DIESEL-RABBIT-INJECTION-PUMP-/220956979552?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AVolkswagen&hash=item33720ff160&vxp=mtr
http://www.ebay.com/itm/150759171822?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2648
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PM SENT.
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Crap, Crap, Crap, and double crap. I had a spare pump a bit back but now is on my spare IP.
Didn't think anyone would try to remove the check valves as it is not necessary, really not.
Live and learn, bother is that it costs money to do that.
DAS
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guys you are awesome thanks for everything i need the car back on the road asap.
rebuilt seems very logical
but i need a pump faster then that.
what do you guys think of this one?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VW-DIESEL-RABBIT-INJECTION-PUMP-/220956979552?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AVolkswagen&hash=item33720ff160&vxp=mtr
maybe later i can get a pump thats rebuilt and keep as spare.
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From where you stand - nothing too much to lose.
Have read many times about the wonders of wax.
Mindfully and cautiously heat it up with heat gun or propane torch and rub a candles butt into it a few times.
Tink it with something good a few times-
then use an easy-out /or/ drive-in extraxtor tool to remove it.
Most times PB Blaster usually does the trick for me -
not had to go with wax yet. And i don't have any candles at the shop -yet.
PB Blast the remaining segment every hour or so and tink it with something good everytime - then heat - then use an easy out or extractor on it.
You "might" get a metal shaving in the pump - and you might have already gotten something into it - but its almost useless to you now anyhow like it sits - i'd go for it.
TDI pump head. Yes but No.
About 98% NO
Will bolt, probably run some, maybe sketchy at best without right injectors.
But its over your head and a waste of a more valuable pump. to be honest
if you can't get that piece out
i can look up a local'ish guy i know who had a couple/few 1.6 NA Pumps that he kept off running engines. He converts diesels to gassers.
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From where you stand - nothing too much to lose.
Have read many times about the wonders of wax.
Mindfully and cautiously heat it up with heat gun or propane torch and rub a candles butt into it a few times.
Tink it with something good a few times-
then use an easy-out /or/ drive-in extraxtor tool to remove it.
Most times PB Blaster usually does the trick for me -
not had to go with wax yet. And i don't have any candles at the shop -yet.
PB Blast the remaining segment every hour or so and tink it with something good everytime - then heat - then use an easy out or extractor on it.
ive tried heating it up, with the welder will it turned red thers no more grip. it wont come out. the metal itself is very week.
yea if you can get me in contact with him i would really appreciate it
You "might" get a metal shaving in the pump - and you might have already gotten something into it - but its almost useless to you now anyhow like it sits - i'd go for it.
TDI pump head. Yes but No.
About 98% NO
Will bolt, probably run some, maybe sketchy at best without right injectors.
But its over your head and a waste of a more valuable pump. to be honest
if you can't get that piece out
i can look up a local'ish guy i know who had a couple/few 1.6 NA Pumps that he kept off running engines. He converts diesels to gassers.
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ive tried heating it up, with the welder will it turned red thers no more grip. it wont come out. the metal itself is very week.
yea if you can get me in contact with him i would really appreciate it
I didn't even notice you had added some input in that re-quote.
But if you can get it that hot again - try shoving a candle into it/on to it.
Do that 2-3 times with heat - candle.
Then a left hand threaded easy-out (threads backwards [counterclockwise] into hole in the delivery valve) as it threads in it will lock inside and turn the delivery valve back out.
or-
a drive-in extractor tool - its like a 4 edged reamer you drive in with a hammer - then wrench it counterclockwise.
Just so happens i drove by where that guy had his shop yesterday, going somewhere else. The place is now vacant and for lease.
There is a NAPA right next door, they will probably know where he went.
Put a WANT TO BUY listing in parts section of NCdubs website.
Probably get some good leads or prospects there too.
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thanks everyone for your help.
met a guy names john west of charlotte.
he helped me out with a pump, bought it installed it. seems good. runs great so far.
thanks vwdiesel community!
also installed new speakers todays!
sounds better
now anyone want my old pump?
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How much for a broken pump that leaks? Would you include the new O ring?
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How much for a broken pump that leaks? Would you include the new O ring?
new o ring is already installed. make me an offer. dont know how much to ask.
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Glad you got hooked up local.
Good to hear its fixed and back on the road already.
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yea its cool.
going to try to make it to bww today at 1:30
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Hi,
I know this is an old post but does anyone know if there is a tutorial of any kind showing how to replace the injection pump head seal (o-ring) without taking the pump off the car and not completely removing the pump head?
Thanks in advance for your help. :)
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Tah Dah, From the archives of this site but bounces you to another.
https://www.vwdieselparts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5311&start=22
Andrew has great advice.
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Does anyone have an updated link for this tutorial? The link in the 4/2019 post appears to be dead
Thanks
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Sure, it was originally posted on this forum and then copied to the other linked address.
http://vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php/topic,4353.msg34061.html#msg34061
That does not cover replacing the little boost enrichment o-ring which is a somewhat involved process if resealing an enrichment equipped pump.