Engine Specific Info and Questions > Diesel Swaps

1.6TD IDI vs AHU 1.9 mTDI - cold weather starts, mpg, weight - Suzuki Samurai

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Chuck1978:
Libby, EXCELLENT info there, thank you for the incredibly helpful reply! I had started off a reply several days ago, but this week has been very hectic!

I was amazed this morning that I was able to start up by 1.6 mechanical had IDI turbo engine after 11 degrees Fahrenheit overnight low, at 10:30AM in 17 degree weather. It was just 11 degrees at 7AM . It started pretty well. Compared to my wife's at least!
My first thought this morning was, oh darnit, I forgot to plug in the Rabbit pickup!!!
I am now thinking that I should not have too much trouble with and IDI with dual batteries and the good glow plugs on an engine in good condition.
I guess it has been many winters since I have actually driven the old rabbit pickup trucks. I try to keep them out of the road salt. All of the 60° rains have washed away. Going junkyard hunting for an AHU/1Z this morning!


your comments about the block and crank only weighing a marginal amount more have swayed me a little bit, as well as the 10% efficiency which I already knew was an issue. The cost of building a mechanical TDI is much higher than I'm building up a 1.6 IDI turbo. Also, the longevity of the engine worth in the pre-chamber cups having a very slight chance of having problems after a higher boost for a high amount of miles, and the TDI running much cooler, are all major factors. I still could go with an old IDI, but I am trying to make this vehicle last me beyond the next 40 years which I can see myself being alive and driving... I honestly I'm trying to set this thing out to be the ultimate four by four and daily driver. The road manners might not be that great no matter what I do with the off-road capability still remaining intact, but I think I can manage it. Aftermarket Aqualu 5/32" thick corrosion resistant marine-grade Aluminum body in the 55" cargo bed LWB (Long WheelBase version) full Toyota 4x4 drivetrain (full floater '85 axles, land cruiser '84-'90 transfer case, R150F rugged transmission). And an AHU or possibly ALH...

I had veered away from the ALH option after two things, one is that none of this Suzuki Samurai VW diesel swap kits work with that engine architecture aside from the engine to Suzui or Toyota transmission adapters, so all mounts, brackets, oil filter angled adapters or remote relocating adapters, Etc will not work with the ALH into a Samurai (I can fabricate all of this, but it is just more work for me - & time is always running short for me), & also I was concerned about the cost of parts, as I had read that in ALH timing belt job costs around $400 in parts, versus an AHU, which is $99... I also wondered that since they are the same basic block architecture, if many parts for the AHU engine were interchangeable with parts all the way back into the early 80s? VS the ALH which was only 1999 - 2004, correct? If we were talking about just primarily only Parts availability 1996 - 1999, vs 1999 - 2004, I suppose that would not be much of an issue. But I assumed that perhaps more parts from the older models would fit the ahu as well. I'm trying to think long long-term, what am I going to be able to get when I am 65 in 24 years?

libbydiesel:
The ALH block style has continued up to the current engines with minor changes similar to how the earlier block style was used from the mid-70's through the mid 90's.  The block itself is stronger and the metallurgy is better so they just don't seem to wear provided you do proper maintenance.  I have one ALH that is a daily driver that has over 260,000 miles and has never used a drop of oil, ever.  I have never seen the level on the dipstick change at all between oil changes.  I like that the ALH drives the oil pump off the crank and the vac pump off the cam, so the intermediate shaft is eliminated.  Also, the 'bypass hose' is cast into the block and the water pump is driven by the timing belt.  The result is that all engine critical components are driven by the crank and timing belt eliminating potential dead-in-the-water situations that can be caused by the failure of non-essential accessories in the earlier engines.  The ALH parts are also at a peak right now, whereas the mk3 TDI stuff is getting somewhat rare.  Just things to keep in mind.  Either engine can can produce similar power and fuel economy, and either can be run with a mechanical pump.  The commonly used Land Rover 300TDI pump is more easily used on the ALH than the AHU.  Just things to consider. 

If there is not support for the engine mounts on the later block style but there is on the earlier block style that could be a deciding factor.

I want to mention that you should take care on where you get an mTDI pump.  Do not get one from Hans auto parts or from Prothe (same person).  I have heard multiple disaster stories and not a single success story with their pumps. 

If you're actually completely rebuilding a 1.6TD or an AHU/1Z, the total cost is much the same.  If you are purchasing a 1.6TD vs. an AHU/1Z the difference in cost really depends on where you find the engines.  Bear in mind that selling off the electronic injection pump and other electronic engine management can offset the cost of getting the mechanical injection pump.

The Land Rover injection pump is an excellent option and IMO the best 'bang for buck' that is currently available for mTDI injection pumps.  They are available new/rebuilt/used and priced accordingly.

As far as planning for 24 years in the future, it's hard to know what the future holds.  I seriously wonder if internal combustion engines or operator driven vehicles will be outlawed by then...  :-P     

Chuck1978:
Well, libby....

Congratulations, as you are doing a very excellent job of convincing me of the ALH engine...
I had figured the metallurgy may possibly be significantly better in the newer generation of blocks. Chevrolet started introducing higher nickel content in some of their engine blocks in the late 1970s, such as the ####509 "010 020" (casting marks indicating 1% more nickel and 2% more tin or vice versa) casting of the 400 small block which I have for a 1971 Chevrolet Camaro project that my father and I were working on a decade ago. Those blocks barely would wear any, whereas the same engine in a slightly older casting would get big ridges at the tops of the cylinders. Likewise with the 5.0 Ford Mustang blocks.

I suppose eliminating the intermediate shaft and the possibility of associated parts going bad, and additional wear needing addressed on a rebuild, is another substantial benefit in choosing an ALH.

I have read two or three threads where people put ALH engines into their Suzuki Samurai, but they did not go into much great detail of engine mount process, although they did weld additional steel to the frame and fabricate their own mounting surface using some universal motor mounts.

Having to purchase primarily only the VW to Toyota V6 transmission adapter as part of the aftermarket supported swap kit would definitely be beneficial from a cost standpoint. I think I will search for more info on ALH swaps into Samurai's.

The other excellent thing about the ALH, is that the Rover 2.5L TDI injection pumps are already the same size snout as the ALH pump bracket accepts, whereas if you put the Rover pump on an AHU or certain model AAZ mounting brackets, that fit this mTDI application, the opening has to be enlarged on the mounting bracket to fit the ALH-sized Rover pump.

ALSO...on an mTDI (or TDI-M as Giles refers to it as) pump build, it is approximately $300 cheaper @ Performance Diesel Injection to supply a Rover pump, OEM TDI pump, and 1.6 IDI pump cores, vs supplying an AAZ pump (which Giles converts to a 20mm shaft from 17mm)  using parts of the TDI pump and 1.6 IDI pump.
 Plus obtaining an AAZ pump core. Although he seemed to indicate that himself being in Canada, finding an AAZ used pump core is much easier than tracking down a Rover pump core.

the other important thing is, even if the timing belt parts cost significantly more to do a proper job on an ALH, the engines are currently very very plentiful used, and I would not likely have to do any teardown. Perhaps replace the rear main seal and other external oil seals while it is out. And a timing belt job. If they do run forever as stated, this is a huge bonus has the engine should still be in better condition, and is newer than the ahu so therefore it will have less miles. Also, I don't have to worry about trying to figure out if it has the older 1Z pistons or not, as the AHU/ALH style pistons are significantly upgraded over the first generation TDI (1Z) pistons.

Chuck1978:
What turbo does the ALH use? I assume it is a VNT.
I was hoping to use a wastegated K14 (2100 or 2300rpm spooling) or K03 (1800rpm spooling?) for simplicity and very little turbolag.

How would one go about fittimg a wastegated small turbo to the ALH?
Is there another applicable turbo that has the same mounting configuration? Or would I be able to use an AHU exhaust manifold? Or is the block/head architecture completely different on the manifolds?



I also had been considering an imported European AFN engine, which I understand is just a more high output heavier-duty version of the AHU, although some AFN engines do not have the proper engine mounting boss threads on the sides of the block as the AHU & older have.

having sputter bearings and stronger rods, different camshaft, and different injectors I believe were the primary differences.


Non-VNT turbo choices or lack thereof could sway me back to AHU/1Z/AFN.

THANKS!

libbydiesel:
If you get a Land Rover 300TDI or 200TDI pump there isn't any reason to have anyone do anything to it other than perhaps the governor mod.  Even unmodified it will perform great and even outperform a stock eTDI.  There is definitely no reason to provide any core injection pumps with it for making into an mTDI pump for a VW.  It already IS. 

Yes, the snout fits the ALH better.  You still need to do a couple trivial external pump modifications but it is 98% bolt-on. 

Stock turbo on the ALH is the VNT15.  Any of the earlier wastegated turbos will bolt up to the ALH without issue.  By earlier I mean ALL of them back to the mk1 1.6TD.  Just get the manifold and turbo and Bob's your uncle. 

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