Canada Catalys

Author Topic: 1.6td loud noise under load  (Read 637 times)

April 23, 2017, 12:10:21 pm

fourbyfourtoy

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1.6td loud noise under load
« on: April 23, 2017, 12:10:21 pm »
hi guys long time lurker first time poster. probably spent over 24 hours searching the web. this forum is the cats meow for these old diesels. thanks to all the people who take their time to contribute. it is appreciated.

so...

i picked up this jetta( 1.6td w T3, rebuilt top end 50k ago 225k on the odo)  a while back. HG staring weeping after 15k and she was blowing white smoke. pulled the pan and found all sorts of ferrous and non ferrous metal in the bottom. i decided to just find another motor as i need to get this thing going for school. picked up a 1.6td out of a vanagon. had to use a bunch of parts from my original motor  including switching the exhaust manifold and turbo from my orig motor (used new gaskets). new water pump and timing belt. primed the pump with AFT and managed to get her running. starts and runs great (only have to cycle glow plugs once).so when i rev it up under the hood i can see smoke coming from somewhere around the manifold  and when i put it under load (driving) it sounds loud and lacks a bit of power. i understand its common for the manifold to warp. i just think it weird that it was fine on my orig motor now it leaks . i tried tightening the ex mainfold bolts and striped the second in from #4. im going to pull the manifold check it for starightness and possibly get it skimmed. new gaskets maybe??? i could probably reuse them eh? maybe ill get the manifold to turbo flange skimmed as well and make some cooper gaskets like other have done. i might as well get new studs and nuts. i thought it could be a leaky injector as the guy i got this motor off of had it sitting in a barn for 6 months. all sorts of brown came out when i was priming the injectors. i used a screw driver to the ear and couldnt hear much of a diffrence between all four.i HATE TOLIET BOWL CLAMPS! i gotta throw a 90 on there with a piece of flex im so sick so that s***. oh yah i figured since i got to take this thing off again in going to install a EGT probe pre turbo in the manifold and hook up a boost gauge as well. does it sound like im on the right track here guys? or could there be other things i could be overlooking?

thanks
fourby



Reply #1April 23, 2017, 01:02:15 pm

vanbcguy

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Re: 1.6td loud noise under load
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2017, 01:02:15 pm »
Easiest way to isolate noises caused by an injector is to loosen off the hard line at each injector one by one when the engine is running. Once you break the seal between the line and the injector it won't have enough pressure to pop, so any noise it is causing will stop.

Noise and power levels can easily be related to timing. Do you have any way to check the pump timing?

Definitely keep those vanagon diesel parts btw, they are in demand.

Sent from my XT1097 using Tapatalk

Bryn

1994 Jetta - AHU M-TDI - Jezebel Jetta
2004 Jetta Wagon - 1.8T - Blitzen

Reply #2April 23, 2017, 03:01:40 pm

ORCoaster

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Re: 1.6td loud noise under load
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2017, 03:01:40 pm »
It sure sounds like you have a problem with sealing the combined parts.  Using new gaskets instead of old should have given you the width you needed to get them to come together but maybe not.  Blowing the exhaust out the manifold instead of through the turbo will rob it of spool up and thus might be the lack of power you describe. 

Checking the timing is a key on any engine for proper power function but your description of start up makes me think it is close.  How about restrictions in the exhaust pipe itself?  You running the stock diameter or some improved size?  As in 2.5 or  2.25 inches?  That C clamp method for getting the pipe to the manifold is a pain in the neck, butt, and all places in between.  Do you know how to use an exhaust clamp as a spreader to get them on and off?  That is the way I found the best without having to buy the special tool that does the same thing.  Perhaps that doughnut gasket might be bad as well or just not doing the job too. 

Keep poking at it and keep us in the loop.  That is what we do here.  Advise and support, encourage and complain. 

Later
Now Own 1981 Caddy as the NEW DISTRACTION to all that is around me.  Project Away!

Reply #3April 24, 2017, 11:32:25 am

fourbyfourtoy

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Re: 1.6td loud noise under load
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2017, 11:32:25 am »
Thanks eh!
I had no idea there was a doughnut gasket in the downpipe i was just using red RTV. Im going to switch to flex and lap clamps anyway. Its got either 2.25 or 2.5 straight back. I dont have a micrometer or special tool to measure timing. The guy i got the motor off of deffinately did a mark and pray timing belt job so it could be out but she sure starts nice.

Fourby

Reply #4April 26, 2017, 10:16:21 am

fourbyfourtoy

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Re: 1.6td loud noise under load
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2017, 10:16:21 am »
Derp found the down pipe doughnut gasket. Pulled the manifold and found #2 was black and wasnt sealing the slightest bit. Manifold is quite warped.  i took it to school with me showed one of the shop guys what i was doing. When i came back he had it all flattend out and purdy lookin! Just waiting on the EGT i ordered to slap her back in.

Thanks for the help
Fourby

Reply #5April 26, 2017, 02:21:22 pm

fatmobile

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Re: 1.6td loud noise under load
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2017, 02:21:22 pm »
You didn't buy felpro exhaust gaskets did you?
 I just got done pulling a Turbo from an '85 Jetta TD.
 The previous owner had put a rebuilt head on it and used felpro exhaust gaskets.
I didn't know when I pulled them that they were felpro, just knew they fell apart and leaked.

I found out they were felpro when I went to O'reillys auto parts and ordered some.
 They are made of cardboard. I knew when I saw them that's what the car's owner used and I refused them.

 He also used some kind of asbestos gasket between the turbo and exhaust manifold,.. like something from a junior high science class bunsen burner , with the metal screen inside it. Lots of whistles coming from this engine. When boost rose it sounded like a pipe organ, ha.
I usually spread a thin coat of copper silicone between the turbo and exhaust manifold, sometime I just use metal on metal.
Tornado red, '91 Golf 4 door,
with a re-ringed, '84 quantum, turbo diesel, MD block

Reply #6May 11, 2017, 01:01:44 am

fourbyfourtoy

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Re: 1.6td loud noise under load
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2017, 01:01:44 am »
I surfaced the exhaust manifold as it was severely warped. Brand new studs and nuts. New victor gaskets with a touch of copper rtv and WTF!!!!???? It still leaks! Just installed boost and egt gauge. Barely builds any boost and sounds like a loud tick but not as bad as before. I'm losing my s*** over this thing!

Reply #7May 11, 2017, 07:25:16 pm

ORCoaster

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Re: 1.6td loud noise under load
« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2017, 07:25:16 pm »
Was the head flat across the exhaust side?  Doesn't do much good to only have one of the two pieces flat.  How about bolt tightening sequence?  Some just start on one end and start reefing em all down.  There is a pattern and you don't bring it tight all at once. 

You might try loosening it up and see if you can retighten and get it to seal up.  Maybe a bit of exhaust crud between the gasket and head?  That stuff it like rock hard as it is carbon.
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