Author Topic: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)  (Read 10362 times)

Reply #15January 01, 2017, 08:08:32 pm

TylerDurden

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #15 on: January 01, 2017, 08:08:32 pm »
The tube to the intake manifold adjusts fuel based on boot pressure.

If you didn't prime the pump after reseal/reinstall, it probably just has air in it... a little air in the IP will make it run badly, a lot will stall the engine.

I'd attach the mighty vac to the outlet of the IP and draw fuel all the way through the pump... then quickly reattach the return line (IP to tank) so little air gets in. Then start the engine before the fuel drains backwards pulling air in from the return lines.

Reply #16January 05, 2017, 05:35:31 pm

oblique

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2017, 05:35:31 pm »
Pulled fuel through the return outlet of the pump with a mityvac with little effort...fuel might've been in the pump all along. How do I check the fuel solenoid? I did remove the spade connector for cleaning...maybe the pump isn't grounded properly?

Reply #17January 05, 2017, 06:14:06 pm

TylerDurden

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2017, 06:14:06 pm »
Pulling the fuel through with a vac is usually easy enough, it is more of a question how much air comes out before the fuel does. If the fuel comes out instantly, the pump was maybe full. Full with zero air is required for proper running, though so I'd use a container and bottle-feed to ensure I pulled a pump-full of quantity into the IP and eliminated air as an issue.

Regarding the fuel solenoid: You can hear it click when you jumper 12V to it... that said, it doesn't prove fuel is passing, or that the connection is good. These rattly engines have a knack for fatiguing wires at their connectors.

After ensuring the pump is full, I'd loosen the lines at the injectors to see if fuel is reaching them all, while jumping 12V to the fuel solenoid during cranking.


Reply #18January 21, 2017, 05:09:47 pm

oblique

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #18 on: January 21, 2017, 05:09:47 pm »
Ok so I pulled fuel out of the pump, until I collected maybe 200mL of diesel. Wasnt full all the way for sure and got lots of air bubbles. Replaced the return hose with new. Tested solenoid: 8ohms with no ignition, 0 with ignition on. Cranked with a fresh battery and after about 2 seconds, she would fire and run for a second and die. Throttle position and ignition advance position had little to no effect each time. She did this consistently.

How did she run fine for 3km after and then suddenly stop? I gravity filled the pump with diesel purge to get her started that time. I also removed the pressure relief valve for inspection and changed the o-rings but I dont see how this would affect anything.

Reply #19January 21, 2017, 07:03:59 pm

TylerDurden

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2017, 07:03:59 pm »
More bubbles... Ja, that timing belt might be too tight and pulling the input shaft enough to let air seep in the new seal. It can happen with a worn bushing.

Or the new seal is borked... air is getting in somewhere, and pretty fast if it only runs for a second.

Reply #20January 22, 2017, 01:31:20 pm

oblique

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #20 on: January 22, 2017, 01:31:20 pm »
Sorry let me be clear. There were lots of bubbles when I first drew fuel out of the pump but they stopped and vacuum held ok for a few minutes.

I initially set the timing with a vernier caliper which wasnt too accurate. Seemed somewhat on the advanced side. If my belt is too tight is it possible timing got pushed out a little further as I drove?

Reply #21January 22, 2017, 02:30:13 pm

ORCoaster

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #21 on: January 22, 2017, 02:30:13 pm »
Belt tightness has nothing to do with timing once you have it locked in place.  What gets some of us is that we have the pump secured to the bracket but the bracket isn't secured to the engine.  That can cause it to rock and might affect timing.  Remember this, the pump timing is sensitive to small changes, like millimeters of distance the internal shaft moves all the way in and out. 

Your air problem has to be due to loose nuts on the pump someplace.  Those on the side that hold that mechanism against the governor shaft are tough to get tight if you don't have the right tool there.  Copper washers can be gouged and not sit flat, and orings and seals can get nipped putting them in.  That is why I use Vaseline on all of them.  It just dissolves in the diesel when running.

Then there is that infamous top seal around the pump.  Sometimes that new gasket needs to be tweaked by removing some tabs to get it to lay down enough to seal it well.  If you don't have hex or torx heads on those bolts, if they are screwdriver slots you should swap them out to the former.  It is way easier to tighten a hex head than a slotted head.  At least for me.


Reply #22January 22, 2017, 04:58:40 pm

TylerDurden

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #22 on: January 22, 2017, 04:58:40 pm »
Sorry let me be clear. There were lots of bubbles when I first drew fuel out of the pump but they stopped and vacuum held ok for a few minutes.

Ja, I got that...  it's the bubbles and that it only runs for a second or so, that leads me to the main seal.

Any chance you got the IN and OUT bolts mixed up?


Reply #23January 30, 2017, 07:41:50 pm

oblique

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2017, 07:41:50 pm »
I assume you mean the torx bolts at the back of the pump? I think they only in one way since theyre different lenths?

Edit:
I think you meant fuel in/fuel out? I used the hose closer to the driver side of the car which has the banjo vertically mounted against the pump body.

So how likely is it that my timing is off?
If I can draw fuel continuously after a while with no bubbles, can it really be the seals?

I just cant get my head around the fact that it ran fine for a little than BAM it cuts out and starts choking out of nowhere. Maybe I hit a speedbump and bent my frame haha. No, this isnt that funny.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2017, 08:01:31 pm by oblique »

Reply #24January 31, 2017, 12:12:28 am

ORCoaster

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2017, 12:12:28 am »
Did you ever check for a vacuum on the supply side?  How old is the filter?  Might it have become plugged with something since you started with the IP?  Short duration runs like it sounds like you are experiencing are from lack of fuel but it might be lack of flowing fuel.  The IP can be fairly full and still have a problem delivering fuel if there is a vacuum on the supply side.  Did you jack up the car and pinch the fuel lines?

Reply #25February 15, 2017, 01:25:44 pm

oblique

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2017, 01:25:44 pm »
First of all thanks guys for staying with me this long, especially throughout my sporadic posting.

So the saga continues. I finally got the car into a garage and decided to check timing.

What I found was that with the flywheel mark lined up with bellhousing arrow, cam locked in place with #1 lobes pointing up (cyl 1 = closest to drivers side), the keyhole on the pump is about 270 degrees off! Meaning the pump sprocket needs to turn 270degress clockwise for the keyhole to line up. Yep.

I'm baffled as to how this is possible as I'm pretty sure I had the cam locked to the pump sprocket when I timed the engine initially. If I did screw it up, is it possible that it ran for a few minutes in this way or did something happen? Right before I lost power and the motor wouldnt start up there was clunk but I dont know if it was a pothole or not.

I dont even know what question to ask here. Any comments? 

edit: is there a way independently verify crankshaft position?
« Last Edit: February 15, 2017, 01:27:15 pm by oblique »

Reply #26February 15, 2017, 01:53:48 pm

oblique

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #26 on: February 15, 2017, 01:53:48 pm »
Correction: That is, with the camshaft locked in, the #4 lobes are pointing up (#4 =closest to passenger side) and the pump keyhole is 90deg off clockwise (needs to rotate 90deg clockwise to line up with keyhole).

Reply #27February 15, 2017, 04:22:13 pm

TylerDurden

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #27 on: February 15, 2017, 04:22:13 pm »
#1 cyl is closest to the cam sprocket...

I'd set the IP timing again.

Reply #28February 15, 2017, 04:55:57 pm

oblique

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #28 on: February 15, 2017, 04:55:57 pm »
Ok so I timed everything up and this time with my dial gauge and adapter set it to 1.03mm. Was at 1.15mm before. Started and ran rough for about 5 seconds with advance pulled all the way out. Applying throttle had no effect except maybe prolonging the rough idle for a second or two. Ran rough but sounded better...no 'marbles' in the engine anymore.

I checked fuel lines behind the motor and under the car as suggested and everything looked ok...no leaks or kinks.

How do I test for fuel with mityvac at the supply side of the pump...its a banjo fitting.

Reply #29February 15, 2017, 07:42:53 pm

oblique

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Re: 1.6TD - wheres my injection pump leaking from? (video)
« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2017, 07:42:53 pm »
Made sure I had fuel at all injectors...check.
Made sure I had fuel at pump supply...check but only a dribble.
Made I had fuel at filter...only half full.

I guess its time to check the lift pump?

 

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