Author Topic: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED  (Read 8845 times)

April 08, 2016, 08:44:27 am

golfmk1tdr

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I just started my 1.6/1.9 combo few days ago and when engine is cold it smokes so bad I am afraid of neighbors calling for fire brigade.
I can't tell how much better  it is warm because I only drove it in the night so I couldn't really see.(it is much better though)
Car has a lot of white smoke, with very rough idle, I've even seen few rings of smoke at the start.

It was sealed with AAZ steel headgasket, and it has APR studs, so I would deem headgasket leak unlikely.
options I am considering:
timing? It's set at 1.00, it seems to run better with choke, I don't know what timing is usual for frankenengine,still, wouldn't that make black smoke?
water in fuel? It was sitting with this tank of fuel for good half year now
DO I NEED AAZ INJECTORS? I am using 1.6 TD injectors, they seem to fit fine so I didn't really think about it much
Headgasket water leak? Is this possible without pressure in water lines?
Or is this just normal for frankenengines? I hope not because it really is a bit much... 

Please help me solve this, I am on my edge mentally and financially, so this is really the last thing I need after all the trouble of building this engine.

EDIT: video of the damn thing
https://youtu.be/XxzCeLMjRs8
« Last Edit: April 08, 2016, 09:09:56 am by golfmk1tdr »


1.6+holset MK1 Golf TDR /TurboDieselRacing
(no GTD because GT is grand tourismo and there is nothing grand and touristic in my stripped out lowered beast)

Reply #1April 08, 2016, 09:08:18 am

RunninWild

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Re: extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2016, 09:08:18 am »
I put one together back in October and I had the same issue. I think it's just the nature of the beast. Try it again during the day but it's not an optimal combo.

Reply #2April 08, 2016, 09:12:52 am

golfmk1tdr

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Re: extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2016, 09:12:52 am »
I put one together back in October and I had the same issue. I think it's just the nature of the beast. Try it again during the day but it's not an optimal combo.

The one you put together is still running? Is it's smoke comparable to the smoke on my video?

I am not sure what to feel if this really is normal  lol  ??? ::)
1.6+holset MK1 Golf TDR /TurboDieselRacing
(no GTD because GT is grand tourismo and there is nothing grand and touristic in my stripped out lowered beast)

Reply #3April 08, 2016, 10:25:34 am

RabbitJockey

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2016, 10:25:34 am »
you can try advancing the timing more, with the lowered compression,i remember reading someone went as far as 1.20 on a franken engine.  also what was the condition of the head and block before this?  are they both fresh rebuilt parts?
01 Jetta TDI 100% stock daily
81 Rabbit:TDI-M ported head, Frank06 cam, PD intake, hybrid T3 turbo, Renault intercooler, Syl20 11mm pump, light weight fw, and yellow California Clutch clutch kit

Reply #4April 08, 2016, 11:52:03 am

vanbcguy

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2016, 11:52:03 am »
Advance! Advance!

Sounds retarded to my ear across the internet.  If it improves when pulling the cold start handle (It's NOT A CHOKE!) then bumping up the timing would be prudent.  The cold start handle adds a few degrees of advance when pulled.
Bryn

1994 Jetta - AHU M-TDI - Jezebel Jetta
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Reply #5April 08, 2016, 12:18:40 pm

RunninWild

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2016, 12:18:40 pm »
Yeah mine smoked about that much but it was probably colder outside then. I put the stock head back on.

Reply #6April 08, 2016, 12:58:48 pm

RabbitJockey

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2016, 12:58:48 pm »
i didn't listen to it, but i agree it sounds retarded
01 Jetta TDI 100% stock daily
81 Rabbit:TDI-M ported head, Frank06 cam, PD intake, hybrid T3 turbo, Renault intercooler, Syl20 11mm pump, light weight fw, and yellow California Clutch clutch kit

Reply #7April 08, 2016, 03:15:47 pm

golfmk1tdr

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2016, 03:15:47 pm »
i didn't listen to it, but i agree it sounds retarded

LOL are you are mocking me??? :) HAHA
 now seriously,I will definitely advance the timing to 1.15 before I start it next time. You were the only one to give at least approximate number, thankyou...

Yeah mine smoked about that much but it was probably colder outside then. I put the stock head back on.

Sounds like you gave up fast, did you try to advance the timing before you put stock back?

Advance! Advance!

Sounds retarded to my ear across the internet.  If it improves when pulling the cold start handle (It's NOT A CHOKE!) then bumping up the timing would be prudent.  The cold start handle adds a few degrees of advance when pulled.

You seem to have good ear, would you say it's only running on three cyl's? Someone on FB said so but I can't hear (I am about 50%deaf so I really can't hear well)

Anyway I hope timing does the trick, but if it doesn't and this really is nature of the beast I plan on installing block heater. I hate driving cold engine anyway...
1.6+holset MK1 Golf TDR /TurboDieselRacing
(no GTD because GT is grand tourismo and there is nothing grand and touristic in my stripped out lowered beast)

Reply #8April 08, 2016, 03:38:25 pm

RabbitJockey

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2016, 03:38:25 pm »
haha no, i meant to say i didn't listen to it the first time because i was at work so i just watched the smoke.  but i watched it again with the sound on and could hear it sounds odd like its very retarded.  how is the condition of the block and the head?  i'd be curious what a compression test would show.
01 Jetta TDI 100% stock daily
81 Rabbit:TDI-M ported head, Frank06 cam, PD intake, hybrid T3 turbo, Renault intercooler, Syl20 11mm pump, light weight fw, and yellow California Clutch clutch kit

Reply #9April 08, 2016, 03:40:23 pm

RabbitJockey

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2016, 03:40:23 pm »
also you can try advancing it as far as you want, where ever it runs well really, theres no rules for stuff like this.

whered you post this on facebook?  the the idi group?
01 Jetta TDI 100% stock daily
81 Rabbit:TDI-M ported head, Frank06 cam, PD intake, hybrid T3 turbo, Renault intercooler, Syl20 11mm pump, light weight fw, and yellow California Clutch clutch kit

Reply #10April 08, 2016, 04:15:13 pm

mtrans

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2016, 04:15:13 pm »
Any chance that pump is 180 off.
No air bubles in clear fuel lines,your injectors are check?
I`ll improve my English

Reply #11April 08, 2016, 04:57:15 pm

wolf_walker

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2016, 04:57:15 pm »
Is it actually running on all four?  It sounds..  wrong.  the put put put put put... 

I've had a couple of these that either with freshly assembled or not run in ages motors smoked white, although not that much,
till I got them out and actually drove them.  I have a post about it here from years ago somewhere.
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Reply #12April 08, 2016, 10:27:21 pm

RunninWild

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2016, 10:27:21 pm »
This was mine when it was cold


This was it warmed up. It didn't smoke when it was warm but I definitely didn't have it tuned right, it didn't make much power down low and sounded like it was misfiring a bit. I probably gave up on it a bit too easy but i was tired of playing with it.

If you live anywhere near Vancouver I have an aaz block I'm planning on throwing out. You can have it for free but it doesn't come with the crank or anything, it's just a bare block...
« Last Edit: April 08, 2016, 10:31:13 pm by RunninWild »

Reply #13April 11, 2016, 03:06:04 am

Toby

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2016, 03:06:04 am »
You guys must be deaf. It is clearly running on 3 holes and occasionally picks up the 4th hole at idle. That smoke looks more blue than white. Do like they told you and bump the timing up a lot and try again. Don't even use the dial indicator, just start advancing the timing and see what happens. Because it is a bastard combo normal timing specs mean little. Have you driven the car yet? Is it down on power or just smoky?

I suspect that you may have a tight valve or low compression in one hole. Or perhaps a bad injector. Does it pick up the dead hole after it warms up?\

In any case pull the injectors and test compression and have the injectors checked.

You need to determine why it is carrying one hole most of the time.

Reply #14April 11, 2016, 05:56:50 am

golfmk1tdr

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Re: Extreme white smoke on fresh frankenengine trouble-VIDEO INCLUDED
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2016, 05:56:50 am »
ADVANCE ADVANCE ADVANCE  ;) THANK YOU ALL! This bastard is smoking black from now on :D
I timed it first to 1.20 and it was still pretty much the same, but with advance it got better... So screw it, I pulled the clock out and timed it ''on the ear''... I turned it all the way to advance I could and suddenly there was almost no smoke.

Then I pulled the advance (''choke'') cable and smoke dissipated completely, I don't think it was running this clean even before on 1.6 engine.

So I put the clock in to see what it is now, it's 1.40  ;D And it still needs more.

Also went on test run, it tends to smoke a bit white without advance pulled, but with advance it's pretty much clean as gas (until boost hits, then I am riding a rocket chased by big trail of black smoke  :D )

I don't know if it still has dead cylinder problem, maybe it will show up again when cold but for now it's definitely all 4 when warm. I suspect there could be one valve that doesn't seal quite just 100%, but it should run in eventually.

How could I get more advance other than drilling larger hole into pump housing?
Is there any problem with having cable pulled all the time?

Anyway I am really glad the smoke is gone, now I just have to figure out if my turbo whines for it's lack or air filter or do I have a bigger problem  :-\
1.6+holset MK1 Golf TDR /TurboDieselRacing
(no GTD because GT is grand tourismo and there is nothing grand and touristic in my stripped out lowered beast)

 

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