1.6l td needs turbo, mls hg, possible pistons :S

[shelbot]

Hey everyone I've been building my 86 1.6l td jetturd over the winter. Giles pump and injectors, rotating assembly is balanced to within .5 grams, stock rods, 76.988 arco pistons, head rebuilt with everything OE, arp head studs, need to grab a single notch mls head gasket, and the never ending turbo search. I have a 18x7x3.5,2.5 in/outlet IC and plan on running 20psi for my dd. I would also like to hear about these pistons. The machinist said they look just like factory but you can't tell the quality of metal by looks. I could at this point put everything together with what I have but spending this much for a failure would kill me inside. So any tips on a turbo replacement, a quality mls gasket manufacturer, and these pistons would be much appreciated.

[theman53]

I had an IC smaller than yours and it suffered from a little added lag, that one would definitely add some. I am running a 28x5x2 with 2" outlets and I would say it is perfect.
I ran arco pistons in my first build. I do not think they are the quality of KS but they are not bad. I would not buy them again as the price is only 100.00 difference and I don't want to keep the guy selling them in business. If you have them already I would not worry, except to get some Goetze rings as the ones on there now are not good. I have a pal that took an engine apart and 3 of the 4 pistons had broken rings. Many say oil consumption is bad with them as well. I like the holset turbo. I haven't ran one personally but the Mitsubishi turbos are built almost identical to the holset and I have friends running them so I would recommend them. If you get a Garrett replace the stock bearing with the 360 one. Napa has Elring or some other OEM company in there altrom line. Search the FAQ for the post I made with the part numbers.

[Dakotakid]

I do believe the pistons are a bit thinner in the wrist pin area. However, they are built for European applications (new vehicles Ford and Isuzu (I think it is)).

I KNOW the rings are NOT good.

One of the most helpful things you could do for yourself is to skillfully port the intake and exhaust ports of the head. Night and day. Night and day in how they move air in and heat out of that head. Not only do you get a better kick in the seat, but, I really think it extends the life of the head and pistons due to the more efficient removal of heat.

Pay special attention to renewing the intermediate shaft bearings.

[shelbot]

Sadly the head is all built ready to go. I will learn how to port over the years and was told by the machinist for the price to power I will get it is just not worth it and said it's something worth learning myself and he's right. I will order a mls HG recommended by many here and one last question about the goetez rings. If my pistons are 76.988 am I after the 77mm? http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1407626

[shelbot]

I've been searching Goetez not Goetze...ermg smh

[Dakotakid]

Correct on ring size. However, you can purchase them from Autohausaz for less money than the "scalper" price on Samba. $13 (USD) times 4 plus some freight.

It will be in your benefit to start "tuning out" your machinist's rhetoric. I opened up my first exhaust ports with the valves in the head. I was not able to clean out behind the valves (due to this), but, it sure as he77 made a very noticeable difference in how the engine pulled. You simply flush out the chips with air and gasoline when done. Whatever. Timid is as timid does.

[vanbcguy]

I've been searching Goetez not Goetze...ermg smh

Bwahahahahaha.... Next you're going to be looking up Lemon Party.

[theman53]

If your machinist doesn't think you would get the benefit of porting it might be a good time to change machinists. Also, no matter who does the bore the spec is .0012", if he bores it .015 half the life of your engine is gone.

[shelbot]

Yes and seems that I also need to change who builds my next pump. Giles is very nice to talk with but in the end I have no idea what I have for a pump besides it was built for 20psi.. Talking with Alcaid has opened my eyes a lot more. I jumped into something without reading the fine print yes I know and once again learned the hard way. I made the order for rings from Autohausaz thanks for that Dakotakid and others answering. Going to purchase a Holest through Alcaid and my stomach has butterflies already.

So on the paperwork I see "Bore & Hone diesel cylinders +.020''/.50mm" I take that means peas to mud for a actual bore measurement?

[vanbcguy]

0.5mm is the first standard oversize for pistons. Did your machinist have the pistons when he did the bore?

And yeah I hear you on the "Bosch secret handshake no we won't tell you what we did" stuff. There have been a few threads on here describing what exactly Giles does with his super pumps - they have a modified governor, there's some machine work to the pump case to allow for more advance, the dynamic advance is tuned for a fairly quiet idle while providing enough advance to give good performance at higher RPMs. Wouldn't be surprised to find out there's changes to the load dependent advance and a few other things too but yeah, I don't get why it has to be a secret. Sure the actual values and methods are proprietary but knowing what was done would be nice.

[burn_your_money]

It's worth pulling the valves to port it. You'll be kicking yourself if you don't do it while you can easily. Even if you can't pull the valves then pull the cam and install the VC and gasket and port it.

[shelbot]

In the end the pump will be nice and fresh for another go and hopefully it holds up to the builders name as I have not heard anything negative about Giles pumps as of yet.

Yes the machinist had the pistons from the very start so in theory everything should be correct. If anyone wants to check out the machine shop I chose at all.
http://www.enginebuilder.ca/

Right now the cam is off and no tappets in either. Tappets are brand new so I still have to bleed them which is another new thing to me as well as removing/installing valves and piston rings.
I could make something to press down the springs to pull the valves. I was hoping I could get away with them in but if I don't get all the debris out then

Tonight I will play with the 77 mechanical head so I don't just dive into a fresh head.I have a second set of ARCO pistons exact same size with some broken rings so I will play with those also. I guess it would be a wise choice to buy a extra set or two of rings just in case I really fudge up installing the Goetze rings.   

[Dakotakid]

Here was the first head I worked on. It had the valves in it when I opened up the exhaust ports.


At that time, I did not venture into working on intakes. And, I was not able to clean the area behind the valves to help with flow. But, just opening up the exhaust holes did wonders for how this engine runs. The only tools I had at the time were two 3/8 inch drills and some crude cutters from Sears. And then I made a crude sandpaper holder to use in a drill by cutting a slot in the end of a small steel shaft.

No, it will never end up in the Smithsonian. But, it sure runs nice. I have now moved into more specialized alum. cutters and a Foredom flexible-shaft power source.

Edit: I really only offer this as encouragement. I mean, you have gone a long way balancing the engine and expensive pump and all that (and, maybe more). After all that "detail work," going one more step seems really logical to me. Just think of all those cv joint cages you can break every time you drop the hammer!

[RabbitJockey]

yeah if you've done all that work a basic port job following the vizard diy is recommended, with out too much fuss there is a lot to improve upon around the the valve seat and bowl area.

[theman53]

I  think the port job is almost as important as the pump.