1980 Rabbit Diesel manual Project

[acidtonic]

Have you changed the belt since purchasing the car?  I don't ever trust the PO on maintenance history and always change the timing belt before placing a VW diesel into service just as a matter of course. 

You can get the Bosch seal kits for a good price (better than many Bosch shops) from the seller angelofishes on eBay.  He doesn't currently have the DGK126 up for sale, but in the past, I have e-mailed him and he has gotten them for me for a better price than Southwest Diesel which is the shop most local to me.  Be sure to ask that he get the actual Bosch as he does have an unknown brand of DGK126 available.  Southwest will also ship the kits if you want to go that route.  The 17mm shaft seal is not included and if you want to get it, it is part number 1 460 283 312. 

As an aside, for anyone rebuilding a VW 1.6TD or AAZ pump, you can either get the DGK121 which is lacking the o-ring for the cold start assembly or get the 126 kit and purchase the aneroid assembly o-ring separately.  The aneroid o-ring is 1 460 210 347.

I'm having an internal struggle over waiting on shipping or paying $80 and rebuilding my seals tonight.....

Again, I haven't changed the belt yet, but after the pump is fixed and not leaking, I will then change the belt. I just didn't want to do a bunch of stuff at once which makes troubleshooting later on down the road more difficult. The car ran and I just got tired of having to re-prime the pump after just 14 hours of sitting. So the timing was in sync, I'm just fixing the leaky cold start seals.

[acidtonic]

Looks like I found a local dealer who sells what I'm after. Turns out he gave me a new part number which is *just* for the cold start seals. Here's the number: 2460223001

Also upon re-reading the Bentley after you guys got me all worried, they have no mention of locking or removing the crank sprocket. Once timing is correct, they lock the pump and cam then pull the belt. Then to reapply they have you rotate the crank manually back to TDC, then the belt is looped over the cam and pump sprocket first so there is no slack. Then they loosen the cam sprocket to tension the belt, then retighten the cam bolt. Then remove the pump locking pin, then you *manually* rotate the crank 2 times back to TDC and finally they send you off to do the pump timing.

After reading that I'm back to where I was.... Belt would be off, cam and injection pump sprockets would be locked. From there I can completely follow the instructions and get back to putting the belt on.....  Even the Bentley says nothing about pulling the crank sprocket or locking it...

[libbydiesel]

I certainly never said to pull the crank sprocket or lock it and I don't think anyone else did either.

You should not tension the belt with the pump lock in place.  For proper tensioning you need the cam sprocket loose, cam locked, pump unlocked and ALL slack moved to the tensioner area by rotating the pump CCW a few degrees and then back to TDC without going past.  For proper tensioning on the 1.6, you also need the tension measuring tool.

I would certainly take this opportunity to change the belt. 

[acidtonic]

I certainly never said to pull the crank sprocket or lock it and I don't think anyone else did either.

I was trying to imply that the belt isn't slipping crank teeth dangerously using the method of removal that I did, especially with two other sprockets at known positions.

You should not tension the belt with the pump lock in place.  For proper tensioning you need the cam sprocket loose, cam locked, pump unlocked and ALL slack moved to the tensioner area by rotating the pump CCW a few degrees and then back to TDC without going past.  For proper tensioning on the 1.6, you also need the tension measuring tool.

I would certainly take this opportunity to change the belt.

We'll get there.... pump first. I want to manually turn it over a few times to verify I haven't screwed up. But first I have to get the pump seals then I can continue..... Thanks for the advice

[libbydiesel]

All I have said about the crank sprocket/belt alignment is that without having pulled off the crank pulley (not sprocket) and marked the timing belt to sprocket alignment, you cannot know what tooth of the belt is aligned with what tooth of the crank sprocket now that the belt has been loosened.   Because, the belt to crank sprocket alignment is unknown at this point, your paint marks on the belt for the other sprockets are meaningless, misleading and paying attention to them could be catastrophic. Ignore the paint marks entirely and time the engine the correct way.   

[TylerDurden]

Looks like I found a local dealer who sells what I'm after. Turns out he gave me a new part number which is *just* for the cold start seals. Here's the number: 2460223001 ...

Dude, my buddy can bring a full Bosch seal kit up to A2 today when he comes up. PM me if you are interested ($20).

(No mainshaft seal.  )

[acidtonic]

Looks like I found a local dealer who sells what I'm after. Turns out he gave me a new part number which is *just* for the cold start seals. Here's the number: 2460223001 ...

Dude, my buddy can bring a full Bosch seal kit up to A2 today when he comes up. PM me if you are interested ($20).

(No mainshaft seal.  )

Ann Arbor is a good hour away from me. I'll pass but thanks.

[RabbitJockey]

All I have said about the crank sprocket/belt alignment is that without having pulled off the crank pulley (not sprocket) and marked the timing belt to sprocket alignment, you cannot know what tooth of the belt is aligned with what tooth of the crank sprocket now that the belt has been loosened.   Because, the belt to crank sprocket alignment is unknown at this point, your paint marks on the belt for the other sprockets are meaningless, misleading and paying attention to them could be catastrophic. Ignore the paint marks entirely and time the engine the correct way.

this.  there is a procedure for the proper timing of these engines for a reason.

[acidtonic]

I got the seals today from a diesel shop a few miles up the road from me. They seem amazingly knowledgeable compared to anywhere else. That's the guy that gave me the newer partnumber and when I showed up today he pulled a book with a huge exploded diagram of my exact pump, then had a list of part numbers for the various pieces or the whole kit. A+ for them.

I got a green seal for the cold start side (he said that was the newer number) and a black seal (he said that was the older number) for the plate side. They only had one of the new number and I wasn't terribly worried since he told me my pump came with the black ones.

I'm going to start pulling it open tonight here in a few, not going any farther than just the cold start seal and the seal behind the plate on the other side. I'll take some pics if I remember.

[acidtonic]

Wow, so I literally couldn't remove a single bolt. I broke 2 screw drivers trying.... Was thinking I could get my sockets that grab stuck bolts but why chew it up and now have to replace the bolts?

I guess I have to get a really big flat-head screwdriver that exactly fits the bolts and then get this thing in a vice. Wasn't expecting that kind of torque on those bolts. I'm wondering almost if someone tried just over-tightening them to stop the leak. These things are ON here.

[vanbcguy]

The green seals are Viton and are biodiesel resistant. The black ones may or may not be but generally you can assume not. They are fine with pump diesel though.

Might want to try and impact screwdriver?

[acidtonic]

The green seals are Viton and are biodiesel resistant. The black ones may or may not be but generally you can assume not. They are fine with pump diesel though.

Might want to try and impact screwdriver?

I'm not sure at this point. I'll have to figure something out. This can't be normal. It's so locked on there I'm afraid to try again. So far both screwdrivers just broke right in half without rounding off any of the bolt. So I have perfect mating surfaces and it hasn't "slipped" against it yet. Only "broke" against it

[TylerDurden]

I'd go for the impact driver... those screws might not have been turned for thirty years. Or, no antiseize got used the last go 'round.

[libbydiesel]

I have disassembled a large number of pumps and the bolts are often that tight on older pumps.  My preferred approach is to clamp the pump in the vice and then use a bit holder style of screwdriver with the right size bit.  I then place a 1/4" 6pt wrench around the bit where it is sticking out of the bit holder.  With the bit in the slot of the bolt I use all by weight to push the bit holder/bit into the bolt and turn it using the wrench.  That works for 99% of the bolts.  For the other 1% I pound an 11/32 12pt socket over the head of the bolt and use a ratchet.  I haven't ever had that fail. 

[acidtonic]

Well I finally got both sides off and was able to replace the O-rings. I was surprised to find the seal opposite of the cold-start advance a different looking size. Looks like it was just really smashed and extra "thin" which made it seem larger. Although I could be wrong, everyone has the same partnumber for both so it must just be from aging.

The cover that came off was soaked in fuel on the edge where the seal should have been stopping the fuel. So I think that this was my leak source and hopefully just these 2 seals will get me fixed up.