1986 Golf 1.6 N/A Crank No Start

[R.O.R-2.0]

WTF!!

why couldnt they have just used the alt to tension the belt, like on a gasser?!

[8v-of-fury]

My 88 uses the alternator to tension the belt.

W/ PS Wo/ AC

[jhax]

Alright guys got my relay today and put it in. Drove 3 miles to class and had to jump it again, drove back to the store and had to jump it in the parking lot. At this point I think its the fact that the alternator hasnt had enough time to charge the battery to start on its own. If only I had a ***ing multimeter damn it. I think ill go into the lab i research in tomorrow and try to figure out my old one's problem. I noticed the fuse had blown so ill take the fuse from the ***ty one i bought and switch it into the old one.

[TylerDurden]

The fuses can blow if it is in current measuring mode and the max value is exceeded. (like probing battery or glow terminals in current mode, instead of voltage mode)

Usually, we only need to measure voltage around the charging system.

[jhax]

i can see that, on another note when I first started the car the belt did not squeal at all. However it did squeal a lot upon downshifting when coming upon a stop light. Any idea what thats about?

[8v-of-fury]

When you clutched the RPM's came down enough to introduce enough resistance on the alt to start the belt spinning. It didnt squeal at higher RPM's because the alt was not workin near as hard to supply the power.

I had this same issue with a lot of load and a loose belt. Would squeal as soon as the revs came down, and then I could turn it all off and it would stop squealing. Get back up to speed, turn the accessories back on.. lol What a pain.

You clearly have major issues still.. I am assuming this was mid day and there was no accessories on.. the battery should run the injection pump alone for hours and hours.

[jhax]

When you clutched the RPM's came down enough to introduce enough resistance on the alt to start the belt spinning. It didnt squeal at higher RPM's because the alt was not workin near as hard to supply the power.

I had this same issue with a lot of load and a loose belt. Would squeal as soon as the revs came down, and then I could turn it all off and it would stop squealing. Get back up to speed, turn the accessories back on.. lol What a pain.

You clearly have major issues still.. I am assuming this was mid day and there was no accessories on.. the battery should run the injection pump alone for hours and hours.

This was at 7pm. The brights were on because i only have one headlight with low beams. I had no other accessories besides the headlights. When i parked in the parking lot I turned the fan on high and watched for any dimming of the headlights and there was no such dimming. So that being said, the only thing I have not changed is the wire going from B+ on alternator to the starter. Other than that is there any other things I should check?

[8v-of-fury]

Well if the belt is slipping, the alternator is trying to charge. So it is working properly. The alt belt will not slip if there is no load.

If all you had on were the head lights and it slipped.. either the belt is now extremely worn, still loose, or there is an extreme load. Have you verified the GP's are not causing this? After you get it started unplug the GP relay and see whats up.

[jhax]

I bought a brand new GP relay and put it in today so im kind of going on faith at this point. I have phyically inspected my belt and it doesnt show signs of ware, it feels firm and tight, there is no dry rotting, no missing teeth, etc. Ill give your unplugging suggestion a shot. But doesnt it make sense that the alternator just didnt have enough time to charge the battery in the 3 miles i drove?

[8v-of-fury]

How did you get it started the first time? Highs on is only 16A, and charging the battery up from a start shouldn't be an issue for a (new alt isnt it?) new 65A alternator.

The belt is squealing for two reasons. It is slipping, because there is load there. It does not squeal free-wheeling the alt.

[jhax]

I had it on my trickle charge for a couple of hours yesterday. 90amp alt, I have A/C

[scrounger]

Nothing wrong with faith/ you did test the gp relay by disconnecting it though right? Much better than dumping money. Since you have a new one that should be no reason to test it really.  Perhaps it was money better spent replacing the headlight or fixing your charging system.

Are you  running the AC? It runs loads the same belt as the Alternator, no?

3 miles (4minutes) may not be enough to replenish a battery. How many hours did you run the trickle charger? over night? is your battery DOA?

I like the comment about current testing rather than voltage testing. Sounds like someone is shorting wires to see if there is a spark. Funny really.

You have been reactive to some suggestions but I don't think you have a real understanding of what is going on. You have no test equipment any more. It is a simple problem. Maybe instead of just throwing parts at it you would be wise to consult a mechanic. I am not saying this with harshness.

I bought a brand new GP relay and put it in today so im kind of going on faith at this point. I have phyically inspected my belt and it doesnt show signs of ware, it feels firm and tight, there is no dry rotting, no missing teeth, etc. Ill give your unplugging suggestion a shot. But doesnt it make sense that the alternator just didnt have enough time to charge the battery in the 3 miles i drove?

[theman53]

I think buying a simple multi meter and test light would be a good start. Those are tools you should have for cars and around the house, so it won't be one time use or waste of your money.

[TylerDurden]

Yup. Cheapie DMMs are good to keep in the trunk, a better one for in the shop.

A squeal when downshifting is common, since the inertia of the alternator momentarily backdrives the belt, regardless of load.

Depending on how much cranking it takes to start the engine, it could take more than a few minutes to replenish a good battery - a marginal battery just adds to misery when charging or discharging.

A mech is not needed at this point, IMO... knowing the battery voltage when stopped and running is.

[jhax]

Oh trust me i know, i have all of my tools in my back hatch all 24/7. I have the DMM in front of me now in class and Im going to take it to the lab after class and try to fix it (soldering stuff). On a side note, I was told by someone that there are mechanics who wont even touch VWs because they are so complicated...I found this confusing as i think the contrary. I usually let the battery charge for a couple of hours (until it got up to 12.4V when I had a working DMM).