Looking at Conspiracy Theories...

[rs899]

tighten the control arm bolts tighter

and the sub frame bolts..

like tighter than you think it needs to be..

HAHA- no.  They already are.

I think this must be what's going on...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YNoNIYqw8Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j44jaJKSpBw&feature=related

these are not my vids, BTW.

I can see some signs of metal contact on top of the arm and in the pocket.  It just doesn't sound like a little bump.

[R.O.R-2.0]

my Jetta used to clunk every time i would accel or stop..

the rear control arm bolt was TIGHT.. but i tightened it more, and its never clunked again..

like, i put my big rattle gun on it, and tightened it till it wouldnt turn any farther..

the bolt was tight.. just not tight enough..

[damac]

I just went to look mine over and didn't get far because I noticed my drivers side control arm is riding halfway down the bushing.  Hmm don't recall it being like that last time I was under the car.   This is with those solid rubber bushings they sell.  I am going to check my torque but I wonder if just one side could be whats going on with mine.

Also I pulled out what I assumed were original vw bushings, didn't notice obvious damage to the arms.

I guess I don't have any choice but to replace all the control arms then?

Does anybody know if these kits require the original vw type bushing or do you just press them in and go?

http://www.autohausaz.com/search/product.aspx?sid=onefi2nmohk0l4zye250fm45&makeid=800026@VW&modelid=1282788@JETTA%20DELUXE&year=1985&cid=control%20arm@control%20arm&gid=10401@Control%20Arm


Sucks for me, I am actually going to get rid of this car but I don't want to do that to the new owner.

[rs899]

Those look like they have the bushings already.  Rock Auto had a bunch of them with bushings and ball joints for $17 each.

[damac]

Those look like they have the bushings already.  Rock Auto had a bunch of them with bushings and ball joints for $17 each.

I should have specified, I meant the metal bushing collar.  I emailed them and this is their reply and I cannot say its anything I have ever seen mentioned in my searches thus far?  My jetta is an 85 not sure if this could apply to your car?  I won't get a chance to measure mine for another week but I am wondering if this even makes sense, I am going from memory but I'm not sure if the upgraded bushing even has enough room to slide in one of those original collars.  Or maybe the collar they are also selling compensates and fits into the smaller bushing and taking up that much more room on a smaller bolt?

Here is a copy and paste of their reply:

Thank you for submitting your part inquiry with AutohausAZ. Whether or not you would need to use the spacer part number 191 407 190A with control arm part number 191 407 151B is not a matter of the control arm design. It is actually matter of the vehicle design. Volksagen used the 191 407 151B control arms from 1985 through 1992 on the Golf, Jetta, and Corrado models. But at some point changed the bolts used to mount the control arm at the rear bushing.

 If your vehicle uses an M15 (15mm diameter) bolt to mount the control arm at the rear bushing, the spacer sleeve part number 191 407 190A would still be required. However, if you vehicles uses an M17 (17mm diameter) bolt, you would not need to use the spacer sleeve.

 Hopefully this information explains the need of the spacer sleeve. Please let us know if you have any further questions.

[rs899]

^^ Well, there's no room in the later solid rubber LCA bushings for the collar.  Might  be nice to figure out a way to bush the bolt where it goes through the solid bushing, but I didn't ( and evidently , most folks don't)

Finally got the new solid rubber in and the problem is gone.  No clunking and nice smooth steady acceleration under power.  I really can't say for certain that it was the flexibility of the old style bushing, or perhaps I unconsciously tightened the living crap out of the bolt.  Technically they are at 96 ft pounds per the torque wrench, but I may have given it an extra tug.

So, another somewhat unsolved mystery.  The old , old, ol (I replaced them 2.5 times trying to fix this) LCA bushings were original and pretty rotten, yet the car did not clunk or handle all that badly, until I made the mistake of changing them.

Now, I noticed one of my front wheel bearings is pretty tight.  I think I had better do something about that soon.  It never seems to end....

[R.O.R-2.0]

^^ Well, there's no room in the later solid rubber LCA bushings for the collar.  Might  be nice to figure out a way to bush the bolt where it goes through the solid bushing, but I didn't ( and evidently , most folks don't)

Finally got the new solid rubber in and the problem is gone.  No clunking and nice smooth steady acceleration under power.  I really can't say for certain that it was the flexibility of the old style bushing, or perhaps I unconsciously tightened the living crap out of the bolt.  Technically they are at 96 ft pounds per the torque wrench, but I may have given it an extra tug.

So, another somewhat unsolved mystery.  The old , old, ol (I replaced them 2.5 times trying to fix this) LCA bushings were original and pretty rotten, yet the car did not clunk or handle all that badly, until I made the mistake of changing them.

Now, I noticed one of my front wheel bearings is pretty tight.  I think I had better do something about that soon.  It never seems to end....

i told you that TIGHT might not be tight enough..

had my Jetta clunk when the bolt was over 100ft lbs..

that bolt is probably closer to 200 ft lbs now, and no clunk..

the inside of my bushing wore a bit, so i made a bushing to fit around the bolt shank, and take up the space between the inner bushing, and the bolt shank..

if i ever change out my bushings, im going with plastic.. i dont care if they ride harsh, and idle rough, because they last forever..

[damac]

just wanted to update as i tended to my 85 jetta that i am going to sell when i finish my truck.  i decided to strart fresh with stock type control arms with bushings installed and used the collars.  right now the car is driving with none of that clunking.  and as soon as i took the old ones off i pushed the drivers side bushing out by hand!(upgrade type without collar)

so i had this experience and one with my first mk1 and from now on i start fresh with new arms on these cars.  the bushings sure seemed to press in with force.

i had done my best to clean the bolts, etc. and torque.  this setup is almost a couple years old so i have been driving around with those clunks that long.

also to my horror i found that not only was the passenger side rear control arm bolt missing, but was broken off inside the captive nut!  had to cut access hole bigger and peel floor back.  ended up putting new bolt and thick washers to shim flush with floor and then used 3 nuts, tightened a bit then tack welded everywhere i could then dumped wax back on top and tacked the floor back down.

that bolt was there last oil change, when im underneath i always check those.  so i have to assume too much gunk or the close to book torque wasn't good enough and things were bouncing around and tore the bolt apart.  that sides bushing doesn't seem to have moved at all though.

i have been pounding the car all week and there isn't a hint of clunking upfront or that shifting of power feeling when on/off the gas. 

[air-cooled or diesel]

f* the haynes manual,
the rca bushings in a mk2 (stock) go in a certain way, pass reverse of drivers, you need a bentley to show you the right way, they have 'kidneys'. that most likely was your problem. if you put in wrong (also same way;drivers/pass)they will fail; most likely quite soon.
also the shop manual has front roll bar bushings at 18lbs-ft, better is to tighten so bushings wont 'crush'; esp important for urethane bushs

[rs899]

^^ you talkin' to ME?  If so, no I had installed the replacement OEM LCA bushing per the Bentley, with the proper orientation.  Just either didn't torque the bolts enough (though I did that per the good book) OR the collars/insrets weren't seated properly..or something.

All is well now.  Except the front wheel bearing that I was complaining about earlier has been replaced, and its replacement is making noise...it never ends.