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td pump hooked to a bucket only pulling fuel from out side?
by
damac
on 12 May, 2012 00:27
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i dont have to use this pump i got with an engine but thought i would post because i have never seen anything like it.
seems like pump was rebuilt, all paint marks intact.
i have had the pump soaking with atf for a couple days now with no change.
even with gravity feed the pump isnt moving fuel normally. i primed it with an electric pump and then ran it and as long as it had both lines in bucket the car seems to idle and rev without smoke.
no fuel out the return line, the flow is moving back toward the inlet and its taking fuel from return side.
if i run the electric pump it will fight that flow but it then had enough back pressure for the hose to shoot off and spray fuel.
not a hint of misfire or smoke when running it this wierd way and idle is good and it reacts to advance lever and pedal. not a hint of fuel leak or air hiising from seals.
i would love to hear an explanation. is it possible i could break it down to reseal and the vanes are just stuck from sitting or something?
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#1
by
R.O.R-2.0
on 12 May, 2012 09:54
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i dont have to use this pump i got with an engine but thought i would post because i have never seen anything like it.
seems like pump was rebuilt, all paint marks intact.
i have had the pump soaking with atf for a couple days now with no change.
even with gravity feed the pump isnt moving fuel normally. i primed it with an electric pump and then ran it and as long as it had both lines in bucket the car seems to idle and rev without smoke.
no fuel out the return line, the flow is moving back toward the inlet and its taking fuel from return side.
if i run the electric pump it will fight that flow but it then had enough back pressure for the hose to shoot off and spray fuel.
not a hint of misfire or smoke when running it this wierd way and idle is good and it reacts to advance lever and pedal. not a hint of fuel leak or air hiising from seals.
i would love to hear an explanation. is it possible i could break it down to reseal and the vanes are just stuck from sitting or something?
sounds like a clogged inlet bolt or something like that to me..
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#2
by
fatmobile
on 12 May, 2012 20:52
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It is possible to put the vane pump in backwards,.. so it pumps fuel out the inlet.
Flipping the outer ring will do that.
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#3
by
8v-of-fury
on 14 May, 2012 20:08
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It is possible to put the vane pump in backwards,.. so it pumps fuel out the inlet.
Flipping the outer ring will do that.
Oddly enough it will still run this way.. but it shouldn't run well. The fuel would be being pumped in to the pump through the 1/364" hole in the out bolt.. And not allowing any pressure to be built inside of the pump..
Unfortunately, I definitely think you are in for a rebuild.
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#4
by
libbydiesel
on 19 May, 2012 06:55
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There are four ways the outer ring can go in and only one of them is right for our pumps. The thicker part of the ring goes to the left and the hole goes toward the top of the pump.
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#5
by
8v-of-fury
on 20 May, 2012 08:34
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There are four ways the outer ring can go in and only one of them is right for our pumps. The thicker part of the ring goes to the left and the hole goes toward the top of the pump.
With only the two screw holes being symmetrical, how could there be four ways to put it in?
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#6
by
libbydiesel
on 20 May, 2012 13:36
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There are three holes, the two bolt holes and a third hole between them on one side of the ring. The ring can be flipped over with the bolts going through the same two holes or rotated 180° so the holes are reversed. That gives you four possible combinations. 1 Center hole up-fatter side to the left. 2 Hole up-fatter side to the right. 3 Hole down-fatter side to the left. 4 Hole down-fatter side to the right.
Hole up-fatter side to the left is the right way for a CW rotating shaft.
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#7
by
8v-of-fury
on 20 May, 2012 16:13
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My bad, I didn't even consider flipping the ring.
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#8
by
damac
on 04 Jun, 2012 19:56
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I got around to breaking this pump down and found what I would call mud on just a portion of the flywheel gear and on the vane pump plate. A couple other spots of rusty type material elsewhere and it wiped off with brake cleaner. Everything appeared to be indexed correctly.
So I cleaned and resealed and left all the settings stock since I still assume it was rebuilt at some point with all those yellow paint marks.
Now its pulling fuel even from the car and spitting fuel out the return line.
But the car won't start or idle without throttle and eventually it will die off even though fuel is still flowing.
I noticed that the advance lever works but the high idle seesaw wasn't. With the car running I messed with the seesaw on both ends of adjustment and there never was a change in revs or idle?
I never had a pump with that seesaw and searched and if the seesaw is the idle setting and turning mine does nothing does that make sense it won't start and run right since that isn't doing anything?
I did for the heck of it mess with residual fuel adjustment and main screw as you would a normal pump vs. the stock settings and fuel screw would make revs hang and residual fuel adjustment would raise idle to start but pump would act lopey and eventually die off even though fuel was still flowing.
There isn't much to hook up under the lid so I'm kind of confused. Is it possible the little spring is stretched out too much and causing all these problems?
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#9
by
theman53
on 04 Jun, 2012 20:23
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Is the pump completely full? Seems odd you having these issues. What was the mud from do you know?
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#10
by
damac
on 09 Jun, 2012 21:56
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pump is full and all of that, its pumping now. the dirty stuff wiped right off, didn't have to pick at it like wvo, etc. no clue why it was there but i swear all the paint swabs look untouched to me when i came across this engine.
i took the lid off and all was hooked up so i decided to start over after looking at how the seesaw travels and one stopper was limiting adjustment in that direction. i backed them off and got the car to start with the risidual screw just so i could see if i could get idle to react.
well duh after starting over with that lever screwed all the way in, then backed out 20 clicks i started to see changes in the idle. right now with no stoppers it is adjustable in each direction and i have it set at 950 or so.
i now notice that there is a dead spot independant of the idle setting in the first stab of the throttle.
so in my search i found a few threads where people say adjust idle on seesaw and not to do it with the risidual screw. i can do that now so now if i put that screw in a few turns it will lessen the dead spot and then rev out.
so does that mean its working right now and i can fine tune? do i want that risidual to effect anything having to do with idle? do i back it off just a hint from that point and stake it?
on another note does it make sense if this pump was rebuilt and fresh that setting the timing at .041" would result in some heavy cackling?
smoke patterns seem ok but it is cackling too much so i want to knock it back a tad. previous experience has me setting my used pumps there and being ok with it.