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Author Topic: 1.6D Swap  (Read 10439 times)

July 06, 2011, 07:55:17 am

veector

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1.6D Swap
« on: July 06, 2011, 07:55:17 am »
Alright so as of yesterday my 1.7 gasser decided to mix coolant and oil and i've just about had it with CIS so i've decided to undertake swapping a 1.6d from a mk2 into my 81 Jetta.  This is my first time swapping a diesel in and am wondering if anyone has any pointers?

Its a complete motor with a semi recent full rebuild.

thanks in advance ;)

Vic


1981 Jetta D
1997 Jetta TD

Reply #1July 06, 2011, 08:21:38 am

veector

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2011, 08:21:38 am »
main concerns are
-fuel lines and tank (can i use my gasser stuff)
-stop solenoid power wire
-glow plug wiring/setup
1981 Jetta D
1997 Jetta TD

Reply #2July 06, 2011, 09:12:51 am

the caveman

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2011, 09:12:51 am »
Super easy. If you want to make it a very nice install, I would source diesel engine mounts, wiring  and fuel tank. That being said, it'll work using the gasser parts. The fuel solenoid and glow plug wiring can be figured out using the Bentley your gasser fuse box and parts sourced from a diesel parts car
" I'm a vegetarian,not because i love animals, it's because i hate plants"
1970 Type 3 fastback
1972 Renault 12
1971 Super Beetle 140 HP 159 ft lbs
1987 Fox
1989 TD Jetta
1990 Fox
1989 Fox
1998 TDI Jetta
1990 T3 German MIL Transporter 1.9 na Giles super pump
1997 Jetta GLX TDI

Reply #3July 06, 2011, 12:09:26 pm

rodpaslow

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2011, 12:09:26 pm »
Wiring is virtually identical to the gasser, other than you can remove the coil and ignition module and use the power wire that went to the coil (as this is the switched wire) and connect this to the injector pump shut off/on.  Alternator, coolant gauge, oil, etc wil be the same.  Cold warm up valve, auxilary air valve, cold start injector and any other electric connections from the gasser will not be needed, if your talking MK1.
99' 1.9 1Z Tdi, hybrid pump -1.9 housing & rover internals, 2052 wastegate turbo,.25 hflox nozzles, SDI intake, CTN tranny
96' 1.6 TD Golf, Giles pump, VNT 17, Gas changed to Diesel, Air to Water Int.

Reply #4July 06, 2011, 12:42:13 pm

veector

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2011, 12:42:13 pm »
thanks for the info, the car is indeed a mk1 and will have pretty much everything gas related ripped out except for the tank

I assume the diesel mounts are slightly tougher rubber?

Will I need to swap in a diesel fuel filler neck, some cars have a larger one to fit the diesel pump
1981 Jetta D
1997 Jetta TD

Reply #5July 06, 2011, 02:52:05 pm

bajacalal

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2011, 02:52:05 pm »
The diesel fuel filler neck would not have the restriction you would find on a gas car that prevents you from filling the car with leaded gasoline. You will either have to enlarge the hole to accommodate the diesel nozzle, which IIRC is the same size as the old leaded gas nozzles were, or find the diesel fuel filler neck.

Reply #6July 06, 2011, 06:24:14 pm

8v-of-fury

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2011, 06:24:14 pm »
I have personally completed this swap twice within the last 6 months. That being two 1.6 mk2 diesel motors in to two 1.7 mk1 engine bays.

Here is EVERYTHING you need to know :)

The gas tank and all your fuel lines will work. The filler neck should work too, as I have yet to see an mk1 Jetta with a small filler neck. Both my 84's and my 81 have the larger filler neck. Go check yours :) and take a picture of it so we can see. For the fuel lines you will need to get under the passenger side of the rear before the axle and take the high pressure pump out of the fuel feed line. Cut the metal fuel line, flare it and then connect it to the metal barb on the side of the fuel tank with some gas/diesel rated rubber hose. Up in the engine bay you can then cut the fuel lines where they come up in to the engine bay, and mount your filter stock like on the passenger strut tower, or passenger fender. Or you can just leave the metal lines going over to the driver side and mount your filter there.

As for the motor mounts three of the four you have now will work, it would be wasteful to find "diesel specific" mounts if your are in good shape. You could replace all the rubber mounts now with HD ones while its out if you want. I assume you will use the original transmission? It will bolt up to the mk2 motor without any problem and whatever clutch you have in there will be fine. While we're on the clutch topic, have you ever driven the car this motor came out of? It might be worth while at replacing while you have everything out on the ground and accessible.. to put it together to find out you only need to take it all back apart would be horrible. Trust me, been there ;). Now this fourth mount that you will need to get, it IS a diesel specific mount only in that it holds the injection pump to the motor.

Injection Pump


To remove the old mk2 mount and replace it with a diesel specific mk1 passenger side motor mount, you have to remove the injection pump from the motor.. and doing so is kind of involved if you've never worked on the vw diesel before. Not hard, just tedious, and needs to be done to a tee (T).

Read This
http://vincewaldon.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=24&Itemid=28

This Is What You Need


This is what you have on the mk2 motor -sorry for the small photo.. notice the lack of the part that mounts to the car?


This is what you have on the 1.7 motor -essentially the mount in this picture.


By taking the pump off the motor and having to put the timing belt back on (which along with the tensioner should be replaced now unless you know for FACT it was done recently) you will need to reset the timing of the crank-to-cam-to-injection pump. It needs to be exact, there has been luck with the "mark and pray" method.. but a few thousandths of an inch and you have pistons touching valves.. is it worth it? possibly.. because inorder to set the timing you either need to know the procedure in the link above, or have someone who knows how.. and also has a set of these;

A Timing gauge and the appropriate hardware to lock the camshaft and pump at TDC for the timing procedure.



The stop solenoid on the pump is easy, as stated just use the wire that originally would be a KEY-ON/START power for the coil. Glowplugs are also easy to setup. You COULD hunt down all the mk1 wiring, and be out a lotta money and time.. and still be left with a subpar glow plug system.. OR you could make your own system from scratch like I did.



So what you see in this picture, is a universal lawn tractor solenoid. Essentially a big relay, one that can handle 50a continuously. . each plug pulls about 10a, so 40a with overhead. The bottom main connection goes directly to my battery + positive, the solenoid is then triggered by a very small gauge wire, as you can see the small black and white wire running up under my coolant bottle to the cabin. The main current is then transferred over to the thick grey wire, up to a buss-bar where each glow plug is then fed by its own fused 12g wire. Basically what this does, is allows an easy glow plug controller to be added to any car.. especially diesel swaps. It also now allows your glow plugs to get the most amperage they have ever seen. Instead of the power going battery, fusebox, glowplug relay, fuses, long wiring, and then the plugs.. it follows a bigger quicker route directly to them. They now see the full 12v, and 10a as compared to 8/9v and maybe 8a it saw on old stock wiring..

I think I have covered most everything, anything you think of dont hesitate to ASK!

Reply #7July 06, 2011, 07:10:20 pm

theman53

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2011, 07:10:20 pm »
Look at the big brain on Jeremy LOL

Reply #8July 06, 2011, 07:56:36 pm

8v-of-fury

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2011, 07:56:36 pm »
Also you will need to source a cold start cable. Mk1 or mk2. they will both work, as I have one with mk1 and one with mk2 ;)

Reply #9July 06, 2011, 08:07:50 pm

veector

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #9 on: July 06, 2011, 08:07:50 pm »
big big thanks 8v of fury definitely answered everything I needed to know ;D ;D ;D

now to source a mount and cold start cable
1981 Jetta D
1997 Jetta TD

Reply #10July 06, 2011, 09:46:48 pm

lovinthedeez

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2011, 09:46:48 pm »
i have an extra ip pump mount if you want it.  pm me.   ;)
location:  ashland, oregon US

Reply #11July 08, 2011, 08:18:15 am

veector

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2011, 08:18:15 am »
thanks for the help guys, seems i found a mount in my city which is quite nice ;D
1981 Jetta D
1997 Jetta TD

Reply #12July 08, 2011, 03:10:20 pm

8v-of-fury

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2011, 03:10:20 pm »
In your pm you said you have a diesel tech to help you out, this will now be just as easy as a gas swap.. Hell easier! No bs fuel systems lol.

Good Luck to you.

Reply #13July 11, 2011, 07:41:48 am

veector

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2011, 07:41:48 am »
thanks again, i've got the gasser out, bay degreasing followed by trimming the wiring fat.
still on the hunt for a mount ;D
1981 Jetta D
1997 Jetta TD

Reply #14July 11, 2011, 07:56:48 am

Patrick

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Re: 1.6D Swap
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2011, 07:56:48 am »
I noticed he was told to pull the high pressure pump near the tank, does the mk1 have a transfer pump in the tank like my mk2 swap? I know I had an old Fox that did.... IF there's one in the tank he'll have to deal with it too, because with the gasser stuff gone it won't get signal to turn it on.. 2 options: Run a wire that makes it go live with the key (I did it with the factory wire at the fuse panel) or remove the pump from the tank.