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Late model V6 3.0l common rail TDI from Touareg into 81 Rabbit...
by
CathodeRayTube
on 26 Oct, 2013 23:43
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This is mostly daydreaming... but iv been daydreaming about it allot... and am wondering if it would actually be feasible. The idea would be to have a monster Rabbit... re-enforce the frame to handle the torque if necessary, dump VWs ECU and either have a megasquirt unit with custom programming controlling it, or some other solution, possibly a "dumb-electronic" custom controller made with simple 74-series ICs reading the various sensors. The custom ECU would allow for multiple modes, either extremely efficient operation (each cylinder skips every-other firing, essentially running at half power using as much fuel as a 3 cylinder engine, but still even) or extremely inefficient/power/black smoke mode (max fuel/hold injectors open on exhaust stroke etc...). I did retain a bit from electrical engineering school so this is all in the realm of being realistic for me to construct...
Mostly im just wondering if it would even fit in the engine bay and would it mate to any available FWD VW transmission...and would it not destroy said transmission..
I know the engine i am talking about is a dry sump type... could it be converted to wet sump with a conventional oil pan? Another thought would be to have the VNT turbo and its wastegate manually controlled via levers in the cabin..
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#1
by
R.O.R-2.0
on 27 Oct, 2013 00:01
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you just need to graft some Quattro into your rabbit, and bolt the 3.0 up to that :-p
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#2
by
CrazyAndy
on 27 Oct, 2013 00:24
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It would be better to try to fit this thing into a Fox or Quantum, or even an Audi 5000 Quattro. Even then, there are so many sensor that I don't know if it would still be feasible to go aftermarket control. It just wouldn't fit into a transverse setup; the transmissions couldn't take it, the bolt pattern does not match up, and most importantly it wouldn't even fit as it is too wide. That is the reason we use VR6s and not V6s, as the common 90 degree V6 will not fit between the firewall and radiator support. An on the electronic and trans side again, you'd probably have to track down a european ECU as no US Touareg/A8/Q7/A6 has these bolted to a manual trans.
That said, the most feasible way I see to do it would be mid mounting w/ a built FWD audi/vw trans. Definitely not the answer you wanted, but . . . it would be fun, granted that's if you survive the wiring and fabrication crucible that project would become. Sorry if I'm not sounding very serious, but such an undertaking as putting such a new, technologically-advanced engine in to a small, lightweight platform as the Mk1 is a true 'go big or go home' project.
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#3
by
CathodeRayTube
on 27 Oct, 2013 01:04
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Actually the "no it wont physically fit" answer is what i was most looking for. I never measured the engine. The electronic controls i still think would be entirely possible and easy to bypass/do away with. A megasquirt system or even a custom built electronic controller would only need to read the crankshaft position sensor and control the injectors...which because of the common rail setup would be very similar to a simple gasser EFI setup... everything fancy like variable valve timing, anything emissions related and basically everything but the functioning of the injectors and fuel pump could just be stripped/ignored. The idea would basically be to use only the block/mechanical parts itself and drive/control it using 1970s technology... i think building a rudimentary controller using only transistors and relays would even be possible...it may run less efficiently than if it were being controlled by an actual ECU, but the displacement alone would make up for it.
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#4
by
CrazyAndy
on 27 Oct, 2013 01:27
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#5
by
Jetmugg
on 28 Oct, 2013 03:11
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Please make this project happen!
I would follow in your footsteps, putting the same 3.0L TDI in my little truck, maintaining the FWD layout.
Steve.
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#6
by
R.O.R-2.0
on 28 Oct, 2013 13:54
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Please make this project happen!
I would follow in your footsteps, putting the same 3.0L TDI in my little truck, maintaining the FWD layout.
Steve.
it WONT fit tho.. if you installed it longitudinal, with an audi trans, it would fit better than transverse, being that it is wider than it is long..
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#7
by
CathodeRayTube
on 29 Oct, 2013 00:30
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Or possibly going nuts and using a trans/transfer case and IFS setup from something like a toyota 4runner, (blasphemy on here, i know, but all the brands are crossbreeding with each other anyway..) and mounting it long ways with an adapter plate and the various frame supports...but then you might as well just stick the entire car on a jeep or bronco chassis...which iv already seen done around these parts..
Are we actually sure the engine wont fit transversely tho? even if we gave up A/C, moved the radiator further front/under a bit and built a big ugly bumper to descise it all...or cut into the firewall a little... has anybody actually measured the engine and the rabbit bay? i thought it would possibly fit just by eyeballing it... but that only works so well... I thought the drive shafts clearing the engine would be more of a problem...and finding a VW trans that would take it... (maybe another brand would work better for this purpose..?)
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#8
by
Jetmugg
on 29 Oct, 2013 08:25
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His application is not mine. Is he prepared to cut a big section out of the firewall and box it in? Is he willing to modify the core support for fitment? I hope so.
Steve.
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#9
by
VW Smokr
on 04 Nov, 2013 07:30
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For one thing, the VAG V6 diesel (iron block/aluminum heads) supposedly weighs right at 500 lbs! Even the V6 gasser (with its alloy block) weighs around 350 lbs. As far as the trans, no, thankfully it won't fit the Rabbit trans. The current 3.0 TDI engines put out up to 406 Lb/ft of torque... even if it could be adapted, the Rabbit trans would be quickly turned to a box of shrapnel. However, the V6 might might fit a VR6 Eurovan's tranny, if you're dead set on a transverse mounting.
FWIW I vote for a mid-engine placement with an 8-speed Quattro drivetrain and paddle shifters! Second choice: find a Touareg 'rollover', and stretch that Rabbit to fit on a Touareg's shortened floor & sub-frame! WTH, be bold... go for the V10 TDI! Have fun with the project.
J.R.
SoCal
