Yanked 1.5 injectors

[Typrus]

As the title says, we yanked the injectors out of the 1.5 "Fun times" engine.
We couldn't get it to do anything but run at 1/2+ throttle, and pretty roughly to boot. And it wouldn't start by itself. A less-than-a-second shot of ether on the face below the intake port of any cylinder to get it to kick over a bit (no knocking) then a smoke-fest commenced. By that I'm talking massive amounts of soot billowing out of the end of our dryer-duct evacuation thing, and all the cracks and seams therein. We just could not get it to smooth out.
Timing showed signs of never being touched. So we left it be.
Primed pump via return.
Cracked injector lines to prime.
Ran an entire can of Diesel Purge through.
Ran about a quart of half-diesel, half-Dex/Merc through.

Still no improvement. Had a full cooling system hooked up. Ran it in crap-mode enough to get the thermostat to lift off. So it was hot.

Anyway...
Took them out, and found the #4 heat shield to have a dark glaze, but be clean and perty-full. #3 had a bit of soot on it, but otherwise good. Both them came right out with a dowel.
#1 and #2 were PACKED with soot. On, around, in the heat sheild, up around the injector nose.... PACKED. Not to mention we could not get them out. At all. Let them soak in the diesel-ATF mix. Nada.

SO.........
I'm assuming #1 and #2 either aren't firing at all or are barely doing so. Safe assumption?

We plan on building a pop tester to see if the pintle is stuck on any of them. Them all looked to protrude the same out of the nozzle body though.

Maybe bum compression on #1 and #2?

My buddy is planning on buying a complete gasket set plus head gasket (4 notch BTW) and a new set of bolts and washers so we can tear in and try to free the rings up. If we pop the pistons out, we'll check the bores, and if we can we'll bottle-hone them all and sand the ring surfaces a little bit. Or at least the middle ring considerign the other 2 have chrome faces. Or should anyway. Maybe 1000 grit paper to get them a little rougher? Any suggestions there?

At $7.50 a piece, nozzles will probably get tried. I'll have to figure out how to shim them to match pops.

WE'LL GET IT DONE DANGIT! Lol.

I keep searching for a IP rebuild guide, but am not having any luck. Nor am I finding a reseal kit. Am I not searching correctly or something? I'd like to figure out how to pop the top off to check for rusting.


Anyone have any input?

[jtanguay]

for a re-seal kit, talk to Giles.  you can find his info in the vendors section.

i think theres a link somewhere that shows how to rebuild a VE pump, with pictures, but can't find the link.  i thought it was in the FAQ section - it was taken from the french side and converted to english...  anyone remember the link?

edit: found it on another site here

[Mark(The Miser)UK]

To check injectors reasemble fuel lines upsidedown. Crnank engine, and watch spray pattern. Protect rubber wear with old rag and plug spill return to banjo.Probably even loosened at pump and twisted will give room enough to see spray :? .... Nah upside down is easiest :roll:

[Smokey Eddy]

To check injectors reasemble fuel lines upsidedown. Crnank engine, and watch spray pattern. Protect rubber wear with old rag and plug spill return to banjo.Probably even loosened at pump and twisted will give room enough to see spray :? .... Nah upside down is easiest :roll:

What kind of reaction do you get out of the lines when you do that? im interested to see is it a huge spray or not so much?
 because, i realize that there wont be much flow but it's high pressure right? but you need a restriction to get pressure

Edit: oh wait, you said to check injectors... uhhh make sure you're no where near them when you get it to crank over. I read that the injectors can inject diesel into your blood and there is no treatment for it other than amputation  :shock:

[jtanguay]

To check injectors reasemble fuel lines upsidedown. Crnank engine, and watch spray pattern. Protect rubber wear with old rag and plug spill return to banjo.Probably even loosened at pump and twisted will give room enough to see spray :? .... Nah upside down is easiest :roll:

What kind of reaction do you get out of the lines when you do that? im interested to see is it a huge spray or not so much?
 because, i realize that there wont be much flow but it's high pressure right? but you need a restriction to get pressure

Edit: oh wait, you said to check injectors... uhhh make sure you're no where near them when you get it to crank over. I read that the injectors can inject diesel into your blood and there is no treatment for it other than amputation  :shock:

the IDI injectors arent as bad as the newer ones though... but yes stay clear of the injectors!  the upside down test method is crude, but quite effective!

[Smokey Eddy]

hear hear!
I plan to do the same test.
Possibly a good way to prime the fuel system as well, no? No compression to fight with and you'll clearly see when diesel comes out. No flooding, no excessive cranking, no towing and so on. may need a big ratchet though.

[jtanguay]

hear hear!
I plan to do the same test.
Possibly a good way to prime the fuel system as well, no? No compression to fight with and you'll clearly see when diesel comes out. No flooding, no excessive cranking, no towing and so on. may need a big ratchet though.

well the only problem is that once its all primed and the injectors are firing, you need to flip them upside down  :lol: best to just get yourself a little feed pump or use a vacuum pump to bleed the pump.

[Typrus]

We did bleed the pump out.
Upside down? Huh? I think we'll assemble a pop-tester... I never had the 1Z injectors balanced when I put the Sprint 520's in it... Let alone the ECU, chip, bigger turbo.... Lol

How should we get the heat sheilds out?

Also... Shimming the injectors? I did a real quick search to no avail. Any suggestions? I'll search Fred's for the 1Z injectors, but the IDI's I'd bet you guys know best. lol.

[burn_your_money]

Have you tried cranking the motor over to blow the heatshields out? That usually works for me. If not, thread a screw down the hole in the heatshield and use a slide hammer or similar and hammer it out.

The following link is graphic but it shows what your hand will look like if you get injected with diesel (or many other liquids) at high pressure. IDI injectors are definitely operating at a high enough pressure to do this kind of damage.
http://www.emedicine.com/orthoped/images/1230552-1241999-2339.jpg

[jtanguay]

Have you tried cranking the motor over to blow the heatshields out? That usually works for me. If not, thread a screw down the hole in the heatshield and use a slide hammer or similar and hammer it out.

The following link is graphic but it shows what your hand will look like if you get injected with diesel (or many other liquids) at high pressure. IDI injectors are definitely operating at a high enough pressure to do this kind of damage.
http://www.emedicine.com/orthoped/images/1230552-1241999-2339.jpg

thanks for sharing.  :shock:

[Typrus]

Wonderful.

I am aware of the risks. Thus why we want to do a contained pop tester, not go shooting diesel everywhere.

Every see someone shoot someone with a 6000PSI pressure washer?
I will not forget that. Thank God his leg healed... Scarred to hell though. Poor kid holding the nozzle had no idea it could hurt someone.

Tried both things. Will try a better screw next time.

Anywho... Any thoughts on other questions?

[zukgod1]

My buddy is planning on buying a complete gasket set plus head gasket (4 notch BTW)

Wait to get the HG till you have the head off so you can get the correct one, don't just get the thickest one by default.

[Typrus]

It has a 4 notch on it now.

[zukgod1]

It has a 4 notch on it now.

That doesnt meant it's the correct one.

[Typrus]

We'll try and get the head off before he makes the order then. I'll have to figure out how to check the piston protrusion. Feeler gauges stacked or something?