86 Golf IP issues, sounds strange, smokes

[autoholic]

My friend has an 86 NA Golf with a rebuilt motor, was running well until he had a fuel system problem which he was convinced was the IP. He removed the IP and bought a reman and installed it (sent original back for core). Then he discovered the real problem was not the IP, made up a few new curse words, fixed the real problem and the car was running well again. He complained that the new IP was making some grinding noises occasionally though.

The car died in about 400 miles and it would not pump fuel, something happended to the reman IP. I removed it and disassembled it for him and found that there were two washers loose and grinding around in there, destroyed the camplate, rollers and sent a bunch of shavings in to the delivery valves and new injectors.

We reassembled the pump with some used parts I had lying around, not great but usable stuff, wasted a whole Saturday.

The car runs OK, but sounds kind of weird: It sounds very diesely, kind of like an old 2 stroke detroit, it does not have the torque it should and smokes alot (lt grey, then black under acceleration), also idles very smooth, it does not miss at all (unless you loosen a line), suggesting to me that the injectors are probably OK, they looked OK but we did not open them up yet.

Sure sounds like a timing problem I know, but the timing is right, we checked it several times; cam, crank and pump, we did the dial indicator at 1.05MM and checked it several times, car runs the same no matter where the timing advance cable is too. I did my Samurai motor the same way and it runs great.


So this much I know: The valves are not tight, the timing sure appears to be right, the fuel is good, air intake/exhaust clear. I'm not sure about compression, but there is no blowby and the car did run strong.

I think it is a pump related problem but I can not imagine what could have happened to it to make it run like it is. I did have some trouble reinstalling  the throttle lever and spring asm (weird design!), but it all seems to be in right.

Any suggestions? Has anyone ever heard them run as I described?

 BTW; The Samurai is running great, been doing some crazy, crazy off roading, I like the torque, but need to get the boost to come in earlier. it kind of feels like riding a 2 stroke dirt bike.

Thanks!

[gigaz2]

have you adjusted the throttle linkage and max fuel screw?

take good pics before any changes!

[autoholic]

I left the max fuel screw where it was, did not fool with it much. I think I adjusted the throttle linkage right, it idles where it should and hits the stop near where it did before diassembly, I can set WOT a bit further with the other stop, but it does not change the way it runs.
I guess the "diesely" sound I am describing sounds similar to nailing. Stange how throttle response is not so good, power is down, smoke/noise is up, under load especially.
Everything points to timing, maybe I should verify the TDC mark on flywheel is infact TDC? I cannot see how anything with that could have moved though.

Thanks

[gigaz2]

sounds like mine

is it hyd or mechanical? can you check what camshaft is in there?
they have a 3 digit number and a letter elsewhere, like 068 B or 068 L

[kane66]

you would know more than I about pump since you actually rebuilt the one yourself. But I had a similar problem with a rebuilt pump (from Prothe) were everything would check out o.k., IE fuel coming out of the pump, timing spot on, injectors good, but no mater what I did the car wouldn't run right, no power lots of gray, black smoke, wouldn't idle. Finally had to go with another pump (after spending 900) messing with the other. Just my two cents but I would find another pump to rebuild and not waste your time on that one.

[autoholic]

Thanks Kane, then the way it's running may indeed be due to a pump problem, I must have screwed something up, I believe it was when I was reinstalling the top cover asm (the 2nd time). Still don't know what I did, but I'm pretty sure it's a pump problem. The only other VW pump I built was my own, and that one went well. They are pretty tricky, must have taken a hell of a long time to design that contraption!

Boy, I only visit this board when I screw something up!

Turns out the pump remanufacturer is going to send another pump to him along with 4 injectors. Stuff happens, no big deal, glad the place has excellent customer service!