My new 2009 Jetta TDI

[Freidenker]

If it jumped a tooth then the valves should have hit the pistons in a zero clearance engine!  Did it run like that? Sound clattery?  ticky ticky?

[subsonic]

I thought about that.  What I think he ment was that while they where working on it, pulling the belt on and off and retiming it to clear the cam position sensor fault, the thought was that the fault was not clearing because the timing was off. I think that is why I was told it was retimed multiple times.  It turned out that it was not a timing issue causing the fault, but oil residue from the previous two oil leaks had contaminated the connection between the cam position sensor and the cam position sensor pickup.  A weeks worth of work and trouble shooting that was cured by cleaning oil residue from a connection.  Looks like it all relates back to the oil leaks.  
After a bit of research, it appears as if the earlier CEL that came on when my wife was driving the car, the glow plug one, that was due to loose turbo intake charge piping, was related to the oil leaks as well.  When the cam seal was replaced the dealer told me that the upper charge pipe had been removed for access.  It most have somehow loosened up after a few days driving and caused the CEL.  
So I now have had the car in for the two seperate oil leaks, the glow plug CEL due to the loose charge pipe from the oil leak fix, and the Engine Fault Workshop CEL caused by the cam position sensor being contaminated by oil from the original oil leaks.  To my mind that is 4 warranty repairs related to oil leaks.  I will be building a file of all my information and having someone from the lemon law office take a look at it. I am not going to file anything yet, but I want to get an opinion on where I stand so far.
On the positive side.....48 hours and still no breakdown!!!

[Freidenker]

Here's a point of interest and shows the value of the Bosch Manual:  p. 387, if the camshaft sensor fails the ECU substitutes the crankshaft sensor to determine when no. 1 is in compression cycle.  If this is the case the engine will take longer to start and a MIL will be generated.  There is redundancy like this for several functions.

[kcfoxie]

I have been following this since you posted on TDIClub.

Glad to see I'm not the only one who feels they are a little too "pro VW" for their own good. (grumbles about lifetime fluids and people who think the owners manual is some holy grail)

Anyhow, I hope your issues are resolved. I know I'd hate the car. It puts my issues in perspective; my 2006 had a bad airbag in the passenger seat -- 4 attempts before fixed right, and it throws codes for:

- Right rear tweeter
- Weight sensor for aigbag, pass seat
- Rear right window intermittent  or implausible signal
- Anti-Shudder valve intermittent functionality

In the end, it starts, stops and has lasted 82k miles. Jury's out on if I'll see a cam failure in the next 40k miles like others have, my DMF took out the clutch before 33k miles; and I footed the $900 to upgrade to Valeo clutch and SMF.

I wish I could say I feel your pain, but your issues are far worse than mine! Best of luck comrade.

[subsonic]

Man it sure seams like there are still some quality control issues that vw needs to work out I guess.

My car has been running well for the last few months.  Of course my wife has claimed ownership of it for this time frame.  She has informed me that she loves the car.  "The seats hug me, it handles great, it has a kick ass radio, and when I push down on the accelerator it says "yes mistress!" and takes off."   :lol:

I had it the other day and noticed that the repair on the center console to eliminate the rattles has a problem.  The vent that is on the top of the dash has popped up out of place, so I will be bring it back in so they can fix it.   Now that the snaow and salt are gone and the car can stay mostly clean, I noticed that when they buffed out a scratch on the rear bumper, they must have run the buffing wheel over part of the rubber trim on the back bumper.  There is about a 12 to 14" section that has that faded out white-ish  look to it that the rubber on bumpers get when they are old.  I am going to press that they replace it.  I am sure I can put something on it to bring the shine back, but it is just going to keep wearing off and the dull section will keep showing, besides, why the hell should I have to keep putting something on my bumber to cover up damage that the dealer did?

Anyway........
Drove about 60 miles on the way home yesterday, mix of highway and back roads, some intown driving with red lights etc.  Averaged 51mpg.

[subsonic]

Drove 57 miles tonight.  Averaged 56mpg :shock:   Wonder if the computer is correct?

[subsonic]

It was time to bring the car in for it’s second oil change at 20,000.  You know the story with the first oil change, overfilled, resulting in oil leaks etc.  So I bring the car into Seacoast VW in Greenland, NH.  As I am handing over the keys I tell the service rep that I would like to have the remains of the 5th quart from the oil change to keep as a spare in the car.  I kind of get a funny look at the request so I explain that the car takes 4.1 qts. for an oil change, not 5.  I then explain again that the car is a 2009 2.0 CR TDI.  The service rep tells me that they are now getting their special oil in 150gal drums and that they are not using the individual qts any more.  That’s fine with me I tell her, but I make sure to tell her that the car needs to have 507 spec oil.  I am told that is no problem that they have it covered.  About an hour and a half go by and I get paged up to the counter.  Cars all done.  I take a look at the paperwork and the only part number I see is for the oil filter.  The only thing it says about the oil change is “Oil Change-SynPower”.  I point this out and ask about the rest of the info.
“Like what?”
What oil weight did you put in?  How much did you put in? Which SynPower did you use, there are 7 different types in the Valvoline SynPower line?
“We used the right one, don’t worry it really good oil.”
The most I can get out of them is that it was 5w-30.  It’s late; I’m missing dinner with the wife and kids so I say fine and head out to the car.  I notice they have stuck one of those pain in the ass service reminder stickers on the windshield instead of on the door column.  I pull the stupid thing off and look at it.  Next service due in 5,000 miles.  I walk back inside, hand it to the service writer and ask why it says 5,000 instead of 10,000. 
“They must have just typed it in wrong, we know it’s not due in for another 10k, don’t worry about it.”
I shake my head and take off.  I can’t check the oil when I get home because it still super hot (40 min drive.), plus it’s raining.  I meant to check it over the next few days but every time I remembered it, it was raining like hell outside.
I still had a nagging feeling that something was not right so I start looking up the info on Valvoline SynPower.  Takes a while, but I do find out that Synpower XL-III 5w-30 is in fact 507 compliant.  I feel a little better but still am not good with the lack of info on the dealer paperwork.  I call back the dealer and ask for the parts dept.  I tell them I have a 2009 2.0CR TDI and ask if the have the oil in stock and how much is it.
“Yep, we have it.  It’s about 10 bucks a qt.”
Is it 507 spec oil?
“That’s what is says right on the bottle.”
Is it Valvoline Synpower?
“Nope, it’s ELF, kind of like Motul, its really good oil.”
I thank they guy and hang up.  I then find the US tech support number for Valvoline and give em a call.  When they come on the line I ask them if they are putting out Synpower XL-III 5w-30 507 spec oil in 150gal drums.
“Not that I am aware of.  You can’t get it in the qts either, we are working on getting it out though.”
I ask the guy if perhaps only the dealers can get it or something.
“No, what I mean is that it is not available right now at all in North America for anyone.”
I ask him to check just to make sure.  He gives me a call back after an hour or so and confirms that the info he gave me before was correct.
I thank him again and give the dealer a call back.  I get the service dept and ask them to tell me exactly which synpower oil they were using for oil changes on the 2009 TDI.  They can’t tell me, they don’t know. Some will have to ask a tech and get back to me tomorrow, but I should not worry because they use the correct 505 spec oil for the PD engine.
Long Pause…………….
“My car is not a PD, it is a 2.0CR TDI that requires vw spec 507 oil.”
I get transferred to Chuck the Service Managers voice mail.
I politely inform chuck that I just had my oil changed within the last week at his dept.  I then explain about the lack of information on the paperwork about the oil.  I then explain that the synpower oil that I was told was 507 spec and that was put in my car is not available in North America at this time.  I tell him about my call the Valvoline that confirmed this information.  I ask him if he can explain this.  I then mention that the parts dept does have 507 spec oil in house and ask why it was not used.  I then mention the line out of the owners’ manual that states if 507 spec oil is not used:

 “Very serious and very expensive damage to your vehicles engine WILL occur.  Engine damage caused by using the wrong engine oil will not be covered by your new vehicle limited warranty.”

I leave my number and ask for him to call me back at his convenience.
After I leave the message I notice it is not raining so I head outside to check the oil level.  Anyone want to guess how much they put in?  That’s right!!!! Just like the first oil change!! 5 qts!!!!  Right off the top of the dipstick.  Wrong oil and overfilled, nice…..
Did I mention I do about 600 miles a week in this car?  Can’t get the car back in until Monday July 6th.

So Chuck calls me up first thing this morning.  He tells me that the oil is 505 spec Synpower and that it is fine in my car, he checked with VW tech support a while back and they said it was OK.  Just a bit different in the ash content.  He has no answer why they have real 507 spec oil in house put did not use it. Different departments and all.  If I want, he will drain and refill with the 507 spec oil and toss in a free oil change for later, but I should not worry about it.  I ask that he identify the exact oil used in the original oil change.
“Synpower MST 5w-30.  It meets 505 spec.”  I tell him I cannot get the car in until Monday and then mention that the car was also overfilled with oil.  Boy, Chuck sure was mad about that!
“There should be no reason it was overfilled! The techs know better then that! I’m gonna have a talk with him!”   So, wrong oil is ok, but overfilled is bad?
I hang up and look up MST 5w-30.  It meets Mercedes spec 229.31 not vw 502, 503.01 or 505.  Nice.  I call VW Customer Care and ask them to pull up my history and then go into this new round of issues.  They were quite concerned.  I am waiting on a call back from Terri the northeast region case manager.
So if you have had the oil changed in your 2009 tdi by Seacoast VW in Greenland NH recently, and the paperwork says Synpower, you now know that the wrong oil is in your car and possibly voiding your warranty.  I suggest you call VW Customer Care and ask for Terri.  You can also call Seacoast and ask to talk to Chuck the service manager and ask him to explain why it is ok to use non-507 spec oil in your 2009 TDI.
I’ll post updates as I can.

[rallydiesel]

That really sucks. You could technically demand a new engine and get VWOA to force the dealership to pay for it. It really bugs me when people half-ass stuff and think it's ok because nobody will know the difference.

[diesel smoke]

Perhaps it is time that you change your own oil. Then you will know for sure that it is the right oil and filled to the proper level.

[gigaz2]

I was gonna say.. you'll have to do your own work to have things done right. Period.

Does it really REALLY (really) matter what oil goes in there? I put everything under the sun within the right weight in my TD idi and it's been good.. yes I know it's older.. but I can't imagine any engine will cry over different types of oil as long as it's the right weight

yes, when you HAVE to pay for it (warranty)
and new engines are getting picky about the oil, tolerances are much tighter

[lord_verminaard]

It was the same story when I worked for VW and the 2004 PD engines came out.  We didn't even have the correct oil for it- it didn't matter who I talked to.  Eventually I told the parts manager to order the correct damn oil, after showing her the VW bulletin, and we finally got it.  The first time I sent a tech away with the correct oil, the service writer was in my face yelling at me because the oil was so expensive and demanded that I take it off so they could put their "bulk" synthetic in it.

I was tight with some local shop owners/enthusiasts, so I sold the oil directly to them by the case (at a slight discount, nobody even bothered to check) and probably moved a hundred quarts a month.  None of the techs used it on the scheduled service oil changes.    I was just a peon parts guy, the service writers thought they owned the place and could pretty much dictate to us how much to charge for things sometimes.

Brendan

[subsonic]

The big factor with the oil as far as I know is how it relates to the emmissions system.   Something about the 507 spec being low ash.  The overfill I have no idea what will happen.  Ya know, I posted the exact same writeup over on tdiclub and have gotten nothing but grief about this is my own fault because I brought it to the dealer instead of doing it myself.  And that letting people know that the dealer was knowingly using the wrong oil was just complaining, or calling vw customer care to report the issue was just whining.  Those guys suck.  Still have not heard anything back from VW yet.

[subsonic]

Customer Care called today while I was at work.  I will call in the AM and speak to one of the north east case managers.  Let you know how it goes.  From reading on the tdiclub, there have been a few 09s swapped out under the lemon laws so far.  One of interest happened in NH, the state I bought mine in.  I'm gonna get hold of the guy to get some pointers from hin on the process he went through.

[fdnyguy]

Sorry to hear of your troubles. My 09 TDI Jetta has been a dream for 9300 miles, the majority of it urban/city driving. It cost me $80 for an oil change. I do NOT agree with VW's free maintenance every 10,000 miles. I drove my 09 to Florida and over the 1200 mile run, I averaged 41-42mpg with 4 people and a fully loaded trunk. So for my sense of security, I spent the $80 on the oil change. Even if VW changes the oil after 2500 miles ( I marked the filter to make sure they do!), I still feel better with a fresh oil change before Florida.

If your car is a lemon, best of luck getting your money back. I would be just as aggravated (if not more) than you with the problems you describe.

Stay safe, stay well. Jimmy

[subsonic]

Been arguing with the dealer and vw customer care for a week now.  Picking up the car tomorrow at the dealer, been there since monday.    I do not forsee a pleasent conversation.  Bastards.