Author Topic: building an M-TDI pump (Read 32880 times)

RabbitGTDguy · « **Reply #15 on:** June 14, 2008, 02:40:30 pm »

Its too hard to try and give an accurate estimate based on even that information provided...if I had to...maybe in the neighborhood of 200+...maybe less/maybe more. You tuning for a mechanical pump and/or the pump tuning and ECM tuning for the eTDI will be one of the biggest determining factors. If they aren't built to work with each other....you'll lose somewhere. You can push all the fuel in the world and if the motor isn't built to support it...then it just won't work.

For instance...if you stayed mTDI then you'd have to come up with another electronic solution (several have been theorized and/or suggested here) or mechanical control for the VNT20 that you are mentioning using... with the eTDI pump...that wouldn't be a problem, but the ECM would need to be seriously remapped in order to make the most of things and there are internal considerations as well that TinTin already mentioned. I don't think there is a "quick" alternative to "max" power to make life easier on yourself other than buying someone elses setup that has already put the work into it .

Joe

RabbitGTDguy · « **Reply #16 on:** June 15, 2008, 05:51:50 pm »

The screw on the back of the pump does not have anything to do with "throttle power" Its simple fuel power/fuel enrichment...so not even really part of the discussion.

"Bending" the speed control is not what is done to achieve the corrected travel of the gov. control mech. I'm not sure where that was mentioned...but the modification to the speed control lever involves work on the internal housing of the pump as well as to the case housing itself.

What are you talking bout with increasing the high end of the throttle (huh?) with a camplate/shim spacer? Plunger shim thickness at the end of the plunger/camplate assembly is crucial for the proper operation of the pump...many pump heads and plungers have been seized for running an improper shim or not including the shim whatsoever. So how is removing the shim going to increase "high end throttle". High end RPM power will be more controlled by proper gov. setup combined with proper advance and fueling. Its not a one or the other sort of thing.

Longer spring and custom spring seat where? That same timing advance discussion (if regarding that) has been discussed before, so its not anything new. Proper timing advance on a mTDI pump involves working with and/or modifying the correct piston for max travel (10+degrees) as well as spring and cover considerations. If you want there is a fairly nicely detailed thread on modifying advance covers on IDI motors for more advance...but thats not the only place to start.

Probably the reason that such parts and a procedure doesn't exist is because someone will end up making money off of it based on others discoveries. The guys that do them, do them for a living (i.e. Giles namely on here....) and do them quite nicely and gurantee their work. Others (Tin-Tin, Karl Mullendore) have just as good pumps and know just as much inside and out but probably don't want to share "all" the info for that reason.

12mm pump head/rotor/plunger assemblies aren't required for a mTDI...but it depends on the power output you want. Wahoo that a 10mm pump head will net you over 100hp...but if you read on with the original post and post connected to the poster's original plan...he is looking for numbers in excessive of 200hp. For that...11mm or a 12mm head will be needed. If you want stock or slightly above stock levels...I'd say with the correctly sized nozzles, etc. 10mm will support 150hp but will be hurting above that in different areas.

All depends on what your looking for.

Joe

Tintin · « **Reply #17 on:** June 15, 2008, 07:20:30 pm »

In my opinion the 12mm head rotor is the best for a M-TDI swap in a heavier truck which does not have need to be powerful for race but torque needed for low end.

As for the M-pump, I think I have given much info on how to built it, in several post and I repeated several times the same thing.

However I think that the time is come to had just revised my old posts............

oldskool rich · « **Reply #18 on:** June 16, 2008, 12:09:44 pm »

these seem quite common in the UK will this or any parts fit?
can it be modified? the guy tells me that this pump is the same for tdi as td, is that possible?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180253989737&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.co.uk%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D180253989737%26_fvi%3D1

ive searched every breakers yard in the UK and the 2.8 LT 99-2000 doesnt seem to exist apart from a complete engine for £1600 :cry:

running out of options, i get my shell next week and still nothing anywhere near an engine to drop in :roll:

Tintin · « **Reply #19 on:** June 16, 2008, 12:42:20 pm »

The pump on Ebay is a Bosch Zexel, Zexel have only 2 hole bolting flange and It's low quality pump. dont touch.

Tintin · « **Reply #20 on:** June 16, 2008, 12:47:20 pm »

Try to find a 1.9L Fiat TDid pump, It's the better and cheap pump for a M-tdi, you can modified it later, I think Its easy to find one of this pump, I already see several of them on Ebay.fr, de, be...... etc.

It's 11mm head rotor and 20mm main shaft.

Tintin · « **Reply #21 on:** June 16, 2008, 12:58:41 pm »

If the rover are really a ''T''DI 4 cyl motor, look at this pump:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ERR6700-LANDROVER-300TDI-DIESEL-INJECTOR-PUMP_W0QQitemZ380036856754QQihZ025QQcategoryZ31348QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Here It's a 12mm pump:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/renault-master-fuel-pump-diesel-van_W0QQitemZ220245608289QQihZ012QQcategoryZ10410QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

etc.. etc...... I spent only 10min on Ebay and i already found lots of potential M-pump.

oldskool rich · « **Reply #22 on:** June 17, 2008, 11:20:20 am »

so if i bort one of these and then im assuming i need to change the shaft, to take the vw pully?

is that it? bolt straight on and away i go?

dont sound too bad, or am i missing sumthin?

RabbitGTDguy · « **Reply #23 on:** June 17, 2008, 01:06:50 pm »

What Martin is saying is that there are several options out there for good mTDI pump bases....some in particular (the ones that he linked you to...) that will be "bolt on" for the most part. For max power though, some modification will still need to be done. However, most of those parts are well on their way to being setup nicely for a mTDI application.

Joe

Tintin · « **Reply #24 on:** June 17, 2008, 01:08:40 pm »

The land rover seems to be a nice DI pump and ''R'' rotation (It's important) I do not know for the shaft, but what I see on the photo, that seems to be correct to bolt up a VW pulley and correct belt alignement.

If you do not buy this pump, I think I will buy it.... and resell it for 650$ héhéhé!! make fast!!

But, make sure that the land rover engine are ''DI'', in the case if it's a IDI motor, the pump It's not good.

Ask for the Bosch pump number and PM me the number.

jimfoo · « **Reply #25 on:** June 17, 2008, 01:41:59 pm »

Land Rovers are DI, at least the 200 TDI and 300 TDI. I'm not sure about the first 2.5l versions.

Tintin · « **Reply #26 on:** June 17, 2008, 02:03:49 pm »

I think also its DI.

It's a 11mm pump for land rover 300tdi (2.5L motor) for 4000rpm pump redline or engine.... I'm sure you can reach 4500rpm without modif.

Injector are 200Bar.

Go for it.

oldskool rich · « **Reply #27 on:** June 17, 2008, 08:36:54 pm »

ive asked about the part number, is the renault one not better as its 12mm?

Tintin · « **Reply #28 on:** June 17, 2008, 09:04:32 pm »

Finally I'm not sure if it's 12mm, I can check tomorow for reanult master 1997 2.5L.

For a 12mm pump, that depend waht your plans with your engine, If it's for drag and race, I suggest you 10mm, or 11mm, I,m not a fanatic of a 12mm head rotor for this application, but like Jimfoo in his landrover It's the best, (trail, rock crawling, towing, etc...) It's only my opinion.

jimfoo · « **Reply #29 on:** June 17, 2008, 09:12:16 pm »

Actually I only have a 10 mm head, but the ladies who go for a ride say it seems much bigger. :lol: