I need ideas to get my '85 Jetta 1.6d to start

[ericgoum]

Hello all,

This is my first post, but I have been following this forum for a while and know it to be a great source of knowledge, I figured I should ask for your opinions on solving my starting issues. Here are my symptoms and things I've tried.

Over the last few days prior to it not starting I would crank for about 10 seconds, then on the 2nd crank it would start right up. I figured I'd wait until the weekend to do some work, it decided to stop working yesterday instead. When attempting to crank it sounds like its very close to turning over but never quite makes it.

I have checked to see if the 50A fuse just up line of the glow plugs was blown since this had happened to me before, that was not the case, it was warm however after cranking. I figured that since it was warm that it was letting the glow plugs receive current. I wanted to test the Amperage pull by hooking a multimeter up in series where the line from the 50A fuse and glow plug first meet to check glow plugs, unfortunately I don't have a multimeter that can handle 48 amps. So I went on to checking fuel at this point. I made sure the injector had fuel by taking off the return line and using a hand vacuum pump to pull any air out. I then reconnected that and checked that each injector was getting fuel, they all were. I have also checked that the fuel shut off solenoid was working properly, although it must of course since the injectors are getting fuel.

At this point I am thinking either one or more of the glow plugs are bad which I doubt or it is the injector. Is there something else I should be considering. I "lucked" out by having Thursday and Friday off already, but I really need to get this figured out by Monday so I can go to work.

Any and all help would be greatly appreciated. I really hope its some silly thing I haven't thought of, I am fairly new to Diesels (may 07) so I wouldn't put it past me to miss something silly.

Thanks in advance!!

Eric

[jtanguay]

have you tried plugging in the block heater?  plug that thing in for a good few hours and then try starting.  if she starts, then its most likely the glow plugs.  if not, then its most likely fuel distribution problems.

get someone to crank the car for you while you check the clear fuel lines (with a flashlight if its too dark) and look for bubbles.  a lot of bubbles means the pump is getting too much air, and can give poor idle or even a no-start like you have.

apparently from what some guys on here have found, the stop solenoid can open partially due to lack of current.  hopefully this is your problem.  best bet is to clean the contact and run a direct 12v connection right from the battery.  make sure to disconnect the wire that goes to it before.  if she starts, disconnect the direct power source, and then troubleshoot it from there.  could be just a corroded contact surface though.  clean with some wd40 or other penetrant.

one thing you could try is just running a direct connection right to the bus bar.  use something like jumper cables and make sure that they aren't touching bare metal on the car, otherwise nice sparks.  vw gp's are 12 volt, but some other cars run 10 volt gp's that will blow if you do this.  basically use an insulator if you're scared of making contact anywhere, hook up the jumper cable and let it sit for about 20 seconds max.  even on a cold day 20 secs should suffice.  after the 20 secs, just turn the key and don't wait for the gp light.  ***this should only be a last resort for troubleshooting the GP's***

usually when some type of connection gets hot, it means that there is a substantial current flowing through it.

always remember, check the easiest first  :wink:

[Doug]

Try to keep things simple. I suggest that you find a cheap 60 amp ammeter that you will then place in series with the glow bus. This is one of the cheapest and simplest ways to check to see that your glow bus is fully functioning. Anything less than 50-60 amps when you first turn the key to start indicates a problem which could be an open circuited glow plug. Do this check first before letting your mind go elsewhere. If all proves well then change out the fuel filter for a fresh one. I have seen filters that are marginal slow the flow of fuel sufficiently to require extra cranking for a cold start.

[bigblockchev]

If the glow plugs are all bad then they will be open circuited.  You can check them by disconnecting the glow plug wire at a convenient location and with the ignition off measure the resistance to ground of the glow plug strap still connected to the plugs. You will need a good digital multimeter  to measure the resistance of the glow plugs. Each plug will have around .8-1 ohm resistance so if one only is good then the resistance will be around that figure from the strap to ground. If two are good it will be half that or .4-.5 ohms , if three are good then the figure will be one third that or .3-.33 ohms, and if all four are good the figure will be in the range of .25 ohms. My guess is that you will find that  there is a high resistance of more than a megohm meaning that they are all fried or open circuited. Usually these engines will fire with only 2 plugs working and sometimes only one, but when the last one goes it is time for ether , a hair dryer in the intake, block heater for a couple of hours or even  replace the dead glow plugs. Cheers Dan

[ericgoum]

I checked the resistance of the plugs and it came out to .8 ohms, I am therefore running over to the local car parts place to get a new set. They are only 9$ a pop so I don't feel too bad about just replacing them all instead of trying to find the 1 that is good. Hopefully this works, I will let you all know tonight or tomorrow depending on how much light I have to work with. Thanks for the help!!

Eric

[rallydiesel]

Did the car run before or did you just get it?

[bigblockchev]

It is usually easiest to get at the glow plugs if you remove the injector lines. at least I have found this to be so. Cheers Dan

[ericgoum]

The diesel ran before, it just decided not to start the other day. The lady at the auto store mis-quoted and it was 9$ for all. Unfortunately it'll have to wait until morning since its now dark out. Thanks for the hint on taking the injector lines out. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed that this solves the problem!!

Eric

[trev]

Check that it's getting fuel to the IP!

 That little bit of info cost me a whack of money and near a year of downtime on my Jetta!

 Culprit was a worn through line, between the filter and the IP. It rubbed on the timing belt cover, and split. Caused the IP to suck air. Found it while pushing fuel into the IP after finally getting the head back on, broken by me, from trying new glow plugs in a parking lot @-20 Deg C.

 Moved too fast, over-torqued the plug, split the boss. $@@%&^**%$#!!!

 Anyway, do the cheap checks first.

 Fuel. Maybe check that the IP cuttoff solenoid is getting power (voltmeter). Would not hurt to actually jump 12v straight to it, and listen for it to clunk.

 $9 for 4 glow plugs! Good price.

 High mileage engine? Good stuff to change them out anyways.

 The one behind the pump is a booger. If you change out the other 3, it may be enough to get you going. Compare the resistance of the old ones when the lead is disconnected, and check if they are about the same as the new, or not.


 Just my hard earned 2cents.

 Cheers
  Trev

[rallydiesel]

I would have to agree with it being a fuel issue. Our old Jetta would start at -5 C on only one glowplug. Is there any smoke out the exhaust while you are cranking it? How did you check that the injectors were getting fuel? Make sure all your clamps are tight and check all the hoses. I would take this opportunity to get a new fuel filter rather than new glowplugs.

[ericgoum]

I replaced the fuel filter a few days ago with no luck, although it was time for it to be replaced. After replacing the 4 glow plugs I was final able to get it to start!!! I am very happy about this and want to thank all of you for your input. I will be sure to come here first with any future issues I will most likely have.

Thanks again!!

Eric

[jtanguay]

just new gp's... cool!  more than likely you will be back here with new problems though if it is your first winter with a diesel.  these engines just love high CCA's (1000 CCA's is best).  otherwise on a really really cold day it will barely turn over!

[Jettadoor]

Glad your problems fixed  

When the multi-meters are not available, a Q&D way to check GPs is to turn on the light above your head and note how bright. Turn on ignition and the light will dim considerably if the plugs are getting juice. As the dash light goes out, the top light will get brighter and after a few seconds you'll hear a click from the relay and the top light comes back to full strength. (The few seconds delay is due to the plugs still getting some juice after the dash light goes out.)

I noticed this after having my plugs changed to fix hard starting since the light never dimmed like that when the plugs were bad!

Wishing you a trouble-free winter